PDA

View Full Version : Bieres De Garde



moonshadow704
07-12-2004, 11:04 PM
I want to make a Biere de Garde, something that I can cellar for a few months and serve as a specialty. However I have never made one before. I have formulated the recipe, but the big issue is finding suitable yeast strain. I am torn between using a White labs/ Wyeast offering, or going out on a limb a culturing from a commercial BDG. Alot of BDG recipes recommend Wyeast 3787 Trappist high gravity, which I have never used. I really want to be authentic, so I'm leaning towards culturing from a commercial BDG. However, commercial BDG's are few and far between in SOCAL. I also was thinking about the New Belgium Biere De Mars yeast. I've used it before in another beer project. It has the nice earthy tones that are identified witha BDG, but it also has a brett mixture in it. The brett is very slight, but is inapropiate for this type of beer......Recomendations?


George

Brewer Bob
12-11-2005, 08:13 PM
Check out the book "Farmhouse Ales" they have a good section on BDG's. My take on the style is high attenuation with a clean profile. I recommend either WY1056, Dry US56 or WLP001 California Ale yeast.
I am but, a lowly homebrewer but, I've been really pleased with the results of this recipe on a 10 gallon scale.

Biere de Garde

A ProMash Recipe Report


BJCP Style and Style Guidelines
19-C Belgian & French Ale, Biere de Garde

Min OG: 1.060 Max OG: 1.080
Min IBU: 20 Max IBU: 35
Min Clr: 5 Max Clr: 18 Color in SRM, Lovibond


Recipe Specifics
Batch Size (Gal): 11.00 Wort Size (Gal): 11.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 29.38
Anticipated OG: 1.080 Plato: 19.23
Anticipated SRM: 12.5
Anticipated IBU: 28.1
Brewhouse Efficiency: 80 %
Wort Boil Time: 180 Minutes


Pre-Boil Amounts
Evaporation Rate: 1.66 Gallons Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 15.98 Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.055 SG 13.51 Plato


Formulas Used
Brewhouse Efficiency and Predicted Gravity based on Method #1, Potential Used.
Final Gravity Calculation Based on Points.
Hard Value of Sucrose applied. Value for recipe: 46.2100 ppppg
% Yield Type used in Gravity Prediction: Fine Grind Dry Basis.

Color Formula Used: Morey
Hop IBU Formula Used: TinsethTinseth Concentration Factor: 1.30

Additional Utilization Used For Plug Hops: 2 %
Additional Utilization Used For Pellet Hops: 8 %


Grain/Extract/Sugar
% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
88.5 26.00 lbs. Pale Malt(6-row) America 1.035 2
10.2 3.00 lbs. Corn Sugar 1.047 0
1.3 0.38 lbs. Black Patent Malt America 1.028 525

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.

Hops
Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
1.00 oz. Magnum Whole 15.10 22.9 90 min
1.00 oz. Tettnanger Tettnang Pellet 4.40 5.2 30 min


Extras
Amount Name Type Time
1.00 Oz Sweet Orange Peel Spice 10 Min.(boil)
0.50 Oz Corriander Seed Spice 10 Min.(boil)
0.50 Oz Ginger Root Spice 10 Min.(boil)
0.50 Tsp Grains of Paradise Spice 10 Min.(boil)


Yeast
White Labs WLP001 California Ale


Water Profile
Profile: Livermore
Profile known for:
Calcium(Ca): 25.0 ppm
Magnesium(Mg): 12.0 ppm
Sodium(Na): 74.0 ppm
Sulfate(SO4): 44.0 ppm
Chloride(Cl): 104.0 ppm
biCarbonate(HCO3): 101.7 ppm
pH: 8.33


Mash Schedule
Mash Type: Single Step
Grain Lbs: 26.38
Water Qts: 40.00 Before Additional Infusions
Water Gal: 10.00 Before Additional Infusions
Qts Water Per Lbs Grain: 1.52 Before Additional Infusions

Rest Temp Time
Saccharification Rest: 145 90 Min
Mash-out Rest: 170 10 Min
Sparge: 180 40 Min

Total Mash Volume Gal: 12.11 - Dough-In Infusion Only
All temperature measurements are degrees Fahrenheit.


Brewer Bob

Greenbrewmonkey
12-19-2005, 10:57 AM
Hello!

Check out Farmhouse Ales by Markowski for sure. But in the mean time, I would recommend against 1056 or US 56. They are clean, but instantly identifiable as 1056 or US 56. You don't want your Biere de Garde to taste like every pub's pale ale, do you?

Compounding the issue, many commercial (imported) versions would be unculturable, as they are often filtered and pasteurized even though sporting that fancy cork finish.

Easiest yeast to use for a clean malty profile would be a German or European ale / alt strain. If you like the convenience & price of dried yeast try S-189.

I myself use a funky Belgian strain. But my beers are generally pushing the edges, if not fully off the map.

The choice is up to you!

Cheers,
Ron
Jolly Pumpkin Artisan Ales

Brewer Bob
12-22-2005, 12:26 AM
Brewmonkey states "I myself use a funky Belgian strain. But my beers are generally pushing the edges, if not fully off the map." :confused:

So why would a clean neutral ale yeast that you can ferment in the 50's with high attenuation give it away? With the graininess of the 6-row and the complexity of the spice nuances, I gracefully digress and wholeheartedly disagree with your assumptions. Although S-189 would work also... I just think there is a place for Wy1056 to brew this style of beer. What charactereistics do you think would give 1056 away when fermented in the mid 50's?
Here's the specs of S-189:
Originating from the Hürlimann brewery in Switzerland but also registered at Weihenstephan under the reference 195, this very popular strain is used by a large number of commercial breweries. Selected for its fairly neutral flavour development, this yeast is recommended for a wide range of lager and pilsen beers.

Ying/Yang

Buckley
12-22-2005, 06:41 AM
This is just my own opinion but I think that brews like BDG and sasoins call for a yeast with a pronounced character, if you want a peppery spice not why not use a yeast that is known for that character? Why go with something neutral and clean when you can add an extra bit of complexity? Using the Dupont and Chouffe strains make very interesting brews! We did a saison with the Choufffe strain last year that was all 2row and a little carapils with the chouffe strain. Turned out better than we could have hoped for, all of our customers swore we added spices to the brew.

Greenbrewmonkey
12-22-2005, 07:10 AM
Hello all!

You most certainly may use 1056 to brew a great Biere de Garde. (I don't, but who wants to be like me anyway!) In my experience every yeast strain creates signature metabolic byproduct profiles, aka flavors. Changing water chemistry, wort composition, hopping, spicing, fermentation programs, all have an impact and can change flavor profiles, sometimes quite dramatically. So 1056, while more neutral than some other yeasts, is certainly not neutral in the Platonic absolute sense. Neither is S-189 or any German / European ale strain. They all product metabolic byproducts of varying types and amounts. In short, they taste the way they taste and they taste differently. You can of course manipulate this to a certain extent, (See above sentence.) but you are still left with 1056, S-189, or whatever. Can you make a good beer? Sure! Can you make a great beer? Sure!

In short, use whatever yeast you like! If everyone brewed like me it would be a pretty boring beeriverse. And I might be out of a job!

Cheers,
Ron
Jolly Pumpkin Artisan Ales
PS I think a little Brett character is OK in BDG, no matter what "THEY" say!

Greenbrewmonkey
12-22-2005, 08:55 AM
Oh,

And a good way to prove it to yourself, split a batch, pitch with the two (or more!) yeasts, and taste the finished results. What a fun yummy experiment! Wish chem lab had been more like this!

I did this last year with my Biere de Mars. Two batches, two yeasts (one was 189, but the other alas, not 1056), both tasting very different, blended together for four months aging in Oak before bottling. Fun, educational, and delicious!

As an added bonus, it sold well too!

Cheers,
Ron
Jolly Pumpkin Artisan Ales

Brewer Bob
12-25-2005, 08:17 PM
Hey Ron,

Just wanted to let you know that I am enjoying and appreciating your input on "Brew Like A Monk" Just picked it up a few days ago and read it cover to cover....fascinating insight into the subtleties of the Belgian Trappist/Abbey Ales.

Greenbrewmonkey
12-26-2005, 06:42 AM
Thanks Bob!

Cheers,
Ron
Jolly Pumpkin Artisan Ales

Brewer Bob
01-15-2006, 06:20 PM
Ron,

Check this thread out over on tastybrew.com Looks like Wyeast got the real mccoy:

http://www.tastybrew.com/forum/thread/48353


Cheers! :cool:

Bob