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First Hand Brett species Sensory characteristics

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  • First Hand Brett species Sensory characteristics

    Hi. Trying to find out any first-hand sensory characteristics of less popular Brett species (particularly if blended with BSI S-11 or Wyeast 3711):

    B. naardenensis
    B. trois

    Trying to choose the ideal strain to use for a house Saison blend. Dry, aromatic, clean fruity profile is what I'm after. Any information is greatly appreciated.

    Thanks.

  • #2
    Trois is one of my favorites to use in hoppier or aromatic styles. Tends to start out as a more tropical citrus, pineapple, melon, etc., then turns more funky and dank over time. Never used it personally with 3711 but have had saisons with 3711 and Trois, and they were fantastic but can't speak to their processes. I have done several pale ales and IPAs fermented only with Trois and have always enjoyed them, but mostly with fruity juicy hops, although it could be balanced out with piney earthy flavors as well. Cheers!

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    • #3
      100% Trois fermentation? How far did it go and how long did it take? Were you able to ustilize it over multiple generations, and if so, were there noticeable changes over time?
      I come from a philosophical belief that to waste good hops by NOT extracting as much flavor and aroma as possible from them is inexcusable, so I'll definitely give it a shot in some Pale and IPA variants.

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      • #4
        I was able to get a 1.065 IPA down to 1.008 within a month, but others have gotten it to ferment down to 1.000 with the right malt base and mash regime. Didn't re-pitch so I can't speak to that. I got most of my ideas for the beer from this site: http://www.themadfermentationist.com...pa-recipe.html
        Don't be afraid to contact the author, he's very nice and will usually answer your questions quickly. Cheers!

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        • #5
          We've also done 100% Brett Trois fermentation on a pretty basic blond beer. Pitched on the low end (500k/ml/*p) and KOed at 68* and let free rise to 74* after 72hrs. Took a while to ferment out, but finished at 1.2*p. Esters where remarkably close to juicyfruit bubblegum/ jackfruit. Very tropical.

          I have also used trois with brux and 3711 in several saisons, and it complements the saison yeast quite well.

          We did trials with b. Naard two or so years ago. I don't remember the fermentation traits well enough to speak about it, but we didn't particularly like it, and haven't used it since.

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          • #6
            But is Trois even Brettanomyces?!?!?
            Gerard
            Forest and Main Brewing Company

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            • #7
              Trois is a variant of Brett Brux, it's the White Labs culture of Brett Brux Drie. According to the Mad Fermentationist, Drie "was isolated from a bottle of Drie Fonteinen J&J Blauw at the behest of Adam Avery."

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              • #8
                Is it Brett? was referring to this recent controversy:





                Dog and Rooster Website. ACL Integrated (Access Control List).

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                • #9
                  I can't tell you scientifically what it is but i can say when pitched with 3711 Saison yeast in primary it definitely gave off aromas and flavors of secondary brett fermentation. Albeit more mild than other brett strains but I definitely perceive it to be "brett like"

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                  • #10
                    We keep a mixed culture of White Labs Brett Brux and Brux var Trois on hand. The whole 'trois' thing is interesting, but at the end of the day, I like what it does, whether it's technically a brett or not. Oh and per the original thread: between the two we get a nice mix of horsey/funky and fruity/pineapply.
                    Russell Everett
                    Co-Founder / Head Brewer
                    Bainbridge Island Brewing
                    Bainbridge Island, WA

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                    • #11
                      I think the issue becomes if it truly isn't a Brett but we still have to pay major yeast manufacturers the Brett up-charge for pitching rates similar to Sacc... something isn't quite right there.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Terroir View Post
                        But is Trois even Brettanomyces?!?!?
                        Hey dude, this is Steve from Tired Hands. Coincidence.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by StaEva View Post
                          Hey dude, this is Steve from Tired Hands. Coincidence.
                          Ha, How's it going out there man?!

                          Re your original question. A while back we were using a blend of 566 and Trois, real cool fruit (over-ripe tropical) character, but very little funk in the time frame we were looking for anyway. We then switched to a blend of 566, bsi brett Drei, and bsi Claus. I really dug this blend, fruit, spice, funk, in pretty quick time frame. Now we're rocking our foraged culture for all our saisons, love them microbial terroirs.
                          Gerard
                          Forest and Main Brewing Company

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                          • #14
                            I have used wyeast 3726 with trois and a strain of Brett (ecy 03-b) from east coast yeast and have been very happy with the results goes well with hops, and you get a mild funk very quickly.

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Terroir View Post
                              Ha, How's it going out there man?!

                              Re your original question. A while back we were using a blend of 566 and Trois, real cool fruit (over-ripe tropical) character, but very little funk in the time frame we were looking for anyway. We then switched to a blend of 566, bsi brett Drei, and bsi Claus. I really dug this blend, fruit, spice, funk, in pretty quick time frame. Now we're rocking our foraged culture for all our saisons, love them microbial terroirs.
                              It's going really well, thanks. Moving from 15 to 40BBL facility in a few months. Just trying to get ahead on production for the move. A 2BBL pilot system is on it's way for R&D, hence my original question. Time to bring some of that good Pennsylvania farmhouse brilliance to these freaks! There's not a lot of Saison brewing happening out here as of right now.

                              Yeah, I had Vera that last time I was in. It was definitely a good blend. Have you done any lab work to see what's in your local culture? I'd be curious to know what's floating around in there...

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