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Thread: ATF forms question

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
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    Kernville, Ca USA
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    ATF forms question

    Maybe someone can help me out. Im in the process of submiting my permit forms for my brewpub and Im a little confused on this form.... I know that I have to submit the ATF F 5130.10 to the ATF but then I also found a form that I need to submit to the TTB which is also F 5130.10 are these the same form? I am in California and also know that I have to submit a form to them also is this the TTB form? Does anyone remember exactly what forms they had to submit to the seperate offices? Any help would be GREATLY APPRECIATED!!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
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    Polson, Montana, USA
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    I believe they are the same form. Probably you'd need to submit it to both agencies (if you can find a address for them both). However, CALL YOUR ATF AGENT or TTB AGENT for the final answer. I'd send it to both to be sure!

    Luck to ya'
    Dave

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
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    Kernville, Ca USA
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    Hey thanks alot Dave, that was going to be my next move today. I will call the ATF and try to get some of this figured out.

    Kyle

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Helena, Montana
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    Kyle,

    The mission of the TTB (Tax & Trade Bureau) was formerly a part of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, & Firearms (BATF). It was recently changed to be a full bureau under the Department of the Treaury - the "mother" agency for the BATF. As far as the forms go, they are one in-the same, except that you probably now have to use the TTB form. You can find all of the updated TTB forms you need for a brewery at :

    http://www.ttb.gov/forms/5000.htm#alcohol

    I have no idea what the State of CA des, but most states do have a separate licensing process. Luck to Ya!

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Pittsburgh, PA
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    407

    Maybe more than you need...

    Mr. Beersmith touched on this already - but regarding the forms themselves, beware the different versions of the federal forms, ATF and revised for TTB. In my recent experience, it wasn't that there was a problem because I was using the wrong version of a particular form, it was just confusing to me because I had two versions of some, and only needed to submit one.

    The folks at TTB licensing were startlingly helpful with this whole process - I got better service there than I did at say, Home Depot - and TTB is a bit of a monopoly! I was truly amazed.

    Also possibly of use, here's the text from a "Table of Contents" document I sent in with my package, listing everything I sent in at this point. You'll notice I chose the "collateral bond" route, as I saw it as a money saver in the long term:

    Enclosed are the following documents:

    1. Brewer’s Collateral Bond (2 original copies) and check for $1,000.00
    2. Brewer’s Notice and the following attachments:
    a. Articles of Incorporation (2 copies)
    b. Trade Name Registration - statement in lieu of (2 original copies)
    c. Diagram of Brewery with dimensions
    d. Legal Description of the Brewery – Property Deed (2 copies)
    e. Supplemental Information on Water Quality Considerations (2 original copies)
    f. Personnel Questionnaire – "insert stakeholder name #1 here" (1 copy)
    g. Personnel Questionnaire – "insert stakeholder name #2 here" (1 copy)
    h. Corporate By Laws (2 copies)
    i. Environmental Information (2 original copies)
    j. Statement Describing Security at the Brewery (2 original copies)

    Best of luck, and welcome to brewing!
    Scott
    Last edited by Sir Brewsalot; 10-04-2005 at 02:58 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Kernville, Ca USA
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    201
    Thanks beersmith for the link.

    Hey Scott thanks for all the great info. This will help out a great amount. Im just hoping(Im sure like everyone else)that this paperwork does not hold me up on my opening date?? Im just confused that I cant submit this paperwork until 60 days before opening. This just dosent seem like it will give me enough flexibility if something is not right. No big deal I guess this will just be another hurdle!!

    Thanks again guys!!

    Kyle

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Albuquerque, NM
    Posts
    13
    This is a very niave question, but I am curious about the licensing for a small brewpub (production under 5000 bbl/year). I thought that you only need to be licensed by the state and that the ATF only became involved if you were larger than that.

    Thanks, Ray
    Ray Langley

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Location
    San Jose, CA
    Posts
    38
    Nope, the ATF/TTB needs to be involved no matter the size of your brewery.

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