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Thread: I need some serious help with a knockout issue

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by MariusGraff View Post
    If the HX it self is working properly you might just neef a bigger pump. That is if you're running the pump you have at full speed and still taking this long.
    this is what I'm beginning to think as well .
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  2. #17
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    Sep 2013
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    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by jebzter View Post
    What size in hp are your pumps? Also, what is the inlet pipe diameter, how many bends are there before the pump? I wonder if the pump is cavitating with the wort but not with water. I find it hard to believe that water wouldn't cavitate under the same scenario, but wort is more viscous, so perhaps the pump is seeing more negative pressure than with water.
    A lot of the info on the pumps spec plate is in Chinese .

    but from what I can read:
    2.2kW ( so I think that's 2.95 hp ??)
    IM B35
    5123 ?
    Y2 90L-2 ?
    220V
    8.3 A
    60 Hz
    3408 r/min
    F ?
    24 KG
    CONN ( has a delta symbol )
    IP 54
    JB/18680-2008(B) ?
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by jebzter View Post
    What size in hp are your pumps? Also, what is the inlet pipe diameter, how many bends are there before the pump? I wonder if the pump is cavitating with the wort but not with water. I find it hard to believe that water wouldn't cavitate under the same scenario, but wort is more viscous, so perhaps the pump is seeing more negative pressure than with water.
    also the piping hard and hose is 1 1/2 . the connection on the HX is 2in with 4 bends
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by UnFermentable View Post
    I will also happen to be driving through town next week - Wednesday I'll be in Homewood for a few mins if you're still having trouble, I'd be happy to help diagnose.

    BTW - 8.5 GPM is about the rate of my march pump on the pilot system.
    I'd love for you to stop by either way . message me
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
    Posts
    22
    Quote Originally Posted by CPESystems View Post
    What is the model, HP and RPM of your pumps?
    A lot of the info on the pumps spec plate is in Chinese .

    but from what I can read:
    2.2kW ( so I think that's 2.95 hp ??)
    IM B35
    5123 ?
    Y2 90L-2 ?
    220V
    8.3 A
    60 Hz
    3408 r/min
    F ?
    24 KG
    CONN ( has a delta symbol )
    IP 54
    JB/18680-2008(B) ?
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    BEMIDJI, MN
    Posts
    87
    I would think a 2+hp pump should be sufficiently sized to knockout a 20bbl batch in well under an hour. To jump back to a previous concern - when we received our HEX for our 15bbl system the plates were indeed tightened WAY too much. We were seeing knockout times upwards of 1.5hrs for 500 gallons of wort with a 1.5hp pump. We were instructed to loosen the plates just until we suspected leaking and then slightly tighten them. We never went that far, but we did loosen the bolts at least a half dozen full turns and our knockout times are now closer to 45 minutes. I suspect we can go even further with opening up the HEX. Also, out ground water is pretty cold year round (Northern MN) but never goes below 42F. Even in the summer we are able to knockout quickly down to 52F for lagers with the HEX loosened up. I'd imagine with your CLT running in the 30'sF you should be able to rocket through a knockout.

    I'm not sure if you relieved any tightness when you reassembled the HEX after taking it apart, but it may be worth investigating if you can open that flow up a bit. Hope this helps!

    Cheers,
    Tom

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
    Posts
    22
    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyB View Post
    I had just this situation with a CIP pump....
    I just double checked and they are all spinning correctly
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by Kyle.Carney View Post
    I'd check that the motor is rotating the right direction for your pump head. If it's running in reverse, you'll still get some flow, but nowhere near what you should be getting. Sounds stupid but I've seen it happen more than once.
    just double checked and they are all running correctly
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by BemidjiBrewing View Post
    I would think a 2+hp pump should be sufficiently sized to knockout a 20bbl batch in well under an hour. To jump back to a previous concern - when we received our HEX for our 15bbl system the plates were indeed tightened WAY too much. We were seeing knockout times upwards of 1.5hrs for 500 gallons of wort with a 1.5hp pump. We were instructed to loosen the plates just until we suspected leaking and then slightly tighten them. We never went that far, but we did loosen the bolts at least a half dozen full turns and our knockout times are now closer to 45 minutes. I suspect we can go even further with opening up the HEX. Also, out ground water is pretty cold year round (Northern MN) but never goes below 42F. Even in the summer we are able to knockout quickly down to 52F for lagers with the HEX loosened up. I'd imagine with your CLT running in the 30'sF you should be able to rocket through a knockout.

    I'm not sure if you relieved any tightness when you reassembled the HEX after taking it apart, but it may be worth investigating if you can open that flow up a bit. Hope this helps!

    Cheers,
    Tom


    yeah this is my next test I'm guessing . I ran water through just the pump and it flies out .... ill let you know
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Burnaby BC Canada
    Posts
    292
    It certainly sounds like flow is your issue so either the pump or the heat exchanger is under sized. I would put a pressure gauge on the inlet and the outlet of the heat exchanger and then try it again. The difference between the two gauges should be less than 10 PSI. If it higher than that there is an issue with the heat exchanger if it is lower then it sounds like a pump issue.
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  11. #26
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Homewood, ALABAMA
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    22
    Quote Originally Posted by CPESystems View Post
    It certainly sounds like flow is your issue so either the pump or the heat exchanger is under sized. I would put a pressure gauge on the inlet and the outlet of the heat exchanger and then try it again. The difference between the two gauges should be less than 10 PSI. If it higher than that there is an issue with the heat exchanger if it is lower then it sounds like a pump issue.
    So having done the plate loosening test . At factory tightness its was 10 1/4 in with a 220 gallon test being 28 mintues

    I loosened it to close to 11in and got a time of 18mintues

    not bad

    I cant loosen it anymore without leaking
    Work is the curse of the drinking class

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