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BIG EXPENSIVE RISK on Beer Line Cleaning and Rinsing

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  • BIG EXPENSIVE RISK on Beer Line Cleaning and Rinsing

    Here's an edited note from a friend of mine on beer line cleaning and rinsing (or lack of).

    Its so important to make sure lines are clean AND RINSED. This was a bad result, but it could have been much worse.

    Hey guys,
    It was an “induced” coma – general anesthesia for two days because they put me on a ventilator because they thought the burning in the throat would swell and block my breathing passages. I’m sitting in my hospital gown now, a week later, hopefully waiting for discharge papers so I can drive home and start my “post-incident” regimen of doctor visits and dietary restrictions. Here’s the generic story, but you may have read other versions of it before… both my wife and I have been sending notes out to friends.

    While coming back from San Antonio to Huntsville, we stopped in New Orleans planning only two days here. It was lunchtime and we stopped in a random place with good yelp reviews. I ordered a beer I’ve had many times. It was a very dark place and I couldn’t see the beer, but I took in one swallow and my mouth exploded in fire. I was choking and gagging, and yelling for water. Someone said “they just cleaned the lines” and apparently one line still had cleaner in it. One interesting note was when people were trying to figure out what to give me. They found the bottle of line cleaner and it was mostly NaOH (caustic soda). One person said “baking soda” which would have been worse. The antidote for ingestion written on the bottle was vinegar (acid), but they didn’t have any close, so I kept swishing and spitting water. Turns out that was the right answer… According to the UMC hospital guys, pouring acid down a throat/stomach with with caustic base would have produced an exothermic reaction (generating heat) which would have done much more damage. The medical experts said water was the right solution. So now you know. The medical guys are going to contact the manufacturer and tell them the bottle of line cleaner should say to give water, not vinegar.

    There was a fiasco with the ambulance that caused it to take about a half-hour to show up. While I was yelling with a Donald-duck voice and swishing water, the police lady shined her flashlight on the pint of “beer” and it was green with little white flecks floating down in it. And now I’m wrapping up a week in the hospital, allowed only soft foods and with voice and taste buds that are still a bit out of whack.

    So… check your beer cautiously before taking a swig.

  • #2
    I train one person to do all our line cleaning. It's all he does here. By having only one person to train, I can make sure they are doing everything right. The last step in line cleaning is to recharge all the lines with beer, until it flows without foam. Even if there is a tiny bit of caustic lye line cleaner hiding somewhere in the lines, the beer will neutralize it.

    A friend and co-worker once sprayed concentrated lye into this eyes. Fortunately, his son was standing right there, and immediately opened two bottles of beer with which he irrigated his eyes. The eye specialist later told him that this action may have saved his vision.

    The most frustrating part of this story was when the hospital called for the MSDS for caustic lye. This is a very common household cleaner--automatic dishwasher detergent, drain cleaner, oven cleaner--and I would think a hospital emergency room would be familiar with it. But, no, I had to copy the MSDS and run it over to the hospital before they took any action, potentially resulting in more damage to my buddy's eyes. Good thing he'd already irrigated with beer and lots of water.
    Timm Turrentine

    Brewerywright,
    Terminal Gravity Brewing,
    Enterprise. Oregon.

    Comment


    • #3
      I'm genuinely surprised by the medics lack of knowledge in respect of an exothermic reactions of very dilute weak acid with circa 2% caustic. Think about it - you couldn't titrate dilute CIP chemical in a lab if this was the case. Standard titration of diluted for use CIP caustic is to use 1 % sulphuric or hydrochloric acid (which you stomach produces anyway).

      However, I suppose that if you drank enough vinegar to completely neutralise the acid, and the formulated detergent contained chlorine compounds, then you could possibly release some chlorine - but I doubt if you could have coped with that volume of vinegar.

      Beer sounds good to me though.
      dick

      Comment


      • #4
        I meant to say that at least you can't do any harm with gallons of cold water, even if it doesn't neutralise the caustic - so definitely safest if not most effective treatment. I have never seen and MSDS that says neutralise with beer (shame) or vinegar
        dick

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        • #5
          Originally posted by dick murton View Post
          I'm genuinely surprised by the medics lack of knowledge in respect of an exothermic reactions of very dilute weak acid with circa 2% caustic. Think about it - you couldn't titrate dilute CIP chemical in a lab if this was the case. Standard titration of diluted for use CIP caustic is to use 1 % sulphuric or hydrochloric acid (which you stomach produces anyway).

          However, I suppose that if you drank enough vinegar to completely neutralise the acid, and the formulated detergent contained chlorine compounds, then you could possibly release some chlorine - but I doubt if you could have coped with that volume of vinegar.

          Beer sounds good to me though.
          My previous life was as a paramedic, we are taught to call poison control for treatment. In most cases, a college level chemistry class is not required for the license.

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by jebzter View Post
            My previous life was as a paramedic, we are taught to call poison control for treatment. In most cases, a college level chemistry class is not required for the license.
            While this is true, caustic lye is, as I pointed out, one of the most common household cleaners. I'm sure it's responsible for the majority of chemical burns seen at an ER. Not knowing the basic first-aid for a caustic burn seems irresponsible. Would a paramedic or ER nurse call the burn center to deal with a small 2nd-degree thermal burn?

            Since we work in breweries, and most of us are daily exposed to caustic lye, we, as the folks on the scene, should consider first-aid for a caustic burn to be part of our first-aid training. Same goes for any other brewery chems. What happens before the ambulance arrives can make a huge difference in the outcome.


            Flushing a chemical burn with tons of cool water is the best thing to do if you're worried about screwing it up. Maybe not the most effective, but prudent. We still teach the beer flush, especially for caustic in the eyes (which has never happened yet at our brewery, knock on wood). I've used it to neutralize a liquid lye concentrate spill on my hands, and can attest it works wonders, plus it's always handy in the brewery. Just open a zwiggle.

            The eye specialist who treated my buddy said the best flush for caustic in the eyes would be a dilute boric acid solution--eye wash, basically.
            Last edited by TGTimm; 05-24-2017, 03:02 PM.
            Timm Turrentine

            Brewerywright,
            Terminal Gravity Brewing,
            Enterprise. Oregon.

            Comment


            • #7
              Thermal burns and chemical burns are treated very differently. Without knowing the exact chemical or blend, it is certainly possible to cause more harm by using the wrong agents. In a situation such as the example, efforts would be towards securing an airway and getting to the hospital asap for the appropriate treatment. Thermal burns are standardized in their treatment, stop the burning process, replace lost fluids, prevent infection. Also, ambulances do not carry neutralizing agents, best we would have is bicarb, which would be good for acids. At the brewery, I agree that we should be able to treat any exposures to chemicals that may occur, this is all about deluging the area with water if it is on the outside. For ingestion, do not neutralize with an acid, small amounts of water or milk can help, but the important thing is do not induce vomiting. If the caustic is pushed back out, it will only speed up the rate at which the airway closes. Here's a good write up on how it is dealt with: http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/813772-treatment

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              • #8
                Chemistry arguments aside, a great argument for a circulating line cleaning system where you are cleaning (and rinsing) all lines at once.

                J
                Justin Smith

                President & Business Development
                Ten Sleep Brewing Co., Inc.
                2549B Highway 16
                PO Box 406
                Ten Sleep, WY 82442
                tensleepbrewing@gmail.com
                www.tensleepbrewingco.com
                www.facebook.com/TSBCo

                Comment


                • #9
                  I like to clean the lines with a caustic line cleaner. I'll take the taps apart for a manual cleaning at least every other cleaning.

                  But then I run a sanitizer step. Usually with a fairly weak solution of iodophor or peracetic acid.

                  Then I push out the sanitizer solution with the beer.

                  Takes a little more time, but it is good for the lines to be sanitized as well as cleaned. And nobody gets hurt!

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