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Glycol setup help - temp probe and solenoid valve or motorized ball valve

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  • #16
    Pressure shutoff

    Originally posted by Crosley View Post
    That sounds awesome. I didn't know that system existed

    Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
    This would be a very easy feature to add but how often is the actual system off. I am all over the head brewer if any FV or brite is empty! In the case that you do have a need all that must be done is to add an inexpensive pressure limit switch right before the pressure bypass and connect it to an SSR that powers the pump. Pressure reaches a preset threshold and pump is shut off until the pressure drops due to a call from an FV or brite.

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    • #17
      anyone have suggestions for solenoids or motorized/actuated ball valves?
      my line is 1/2 inch. I could always put a 1/2" barb to 3/4' MPT as im coming across more valves with 3/4"

      does anyone put a filter before the valve? The brewery can get pretty dusty/dirty from the dirt road and cars passing by. and im reading alot of instances of solenoids getting stuck when debris gets caught inside the line. we do the best we can keeping things clean and sealed, but its sometimes an impossible fight. so im leaning towards a ball valve over the solenoid. unless an inline filter would take care of that problem.
      any suggestions on valves and filters would be great. grainger have the best selection?

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      • #18
        Glycol System

        Originally posted by NicaHops View Post
        anyone have suggestions for solenoids or motorized/actuated ball valves?
        my line is 1/2 inch. I could always put a 1/2" barb to 3/4' MPT as im coming across more valves with 3/4"

        does anyone put a filter before the valve? The brewery can get pretty dusty/dirty from the dirt road and cars passing by. and im reading alot of instances of solenoids getting stuck when debris gets caught inside the line. we do the best we can keeping things clean and sealed, but its sometimes an impossible fight. so im leaning towards a ball valve over the solenoid. unless an inline filter would take care of that problem.
        any suggestions on valves and filters would be great. grainger have the best selection?

        We use electric parker solenoid valves; which hold up very well. As for a filter inline, it couldn't hurt; although, we have ground level filters inline near the chiller itself. This allows for us to clean them out regularly. A ball valve before the solenoid wouldn't hurt, but having one behind could prevent any loss of glycol if you had to disassemble the solenoid for repair/replacement.





        Here are some links that may assist you. Good luck!

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        • #19
          Originally posted by NicaHops View Post
          anyone have suggestions for solenoids or motorized/actuated ball valves?
          my line is 1/2 inch. I could always put a 1/2" barb to 3/4' MPT as im coming across more valves with 3/4"

          does anyone put a filter before the valve? The brewery can get pretty dusty/dirty from the dirt road and cars passing by. and im reading alot of instances of solenoids getting stuck when debris gets caught inside the line. we do the best we can keeping things clean and sealed, but its sometimes an impossible fight. so im leaning towards a ball valve over the solenoid. unless an inline filter would take care of that problem.
          any suggestions on valves and filters would be great. grainger have the best selection?
          From my experience a the screen filter that most if not all glycol units have in their tank will do the job in all but the most dirty environments. There are any number of cartridge type filters you could place in line. Basically like the cartridge filters in most homes. I still am a firm believer in solenoid over ball valve. I purchased our solenoids from duda diesel as they are the least expensive but still stand behind all their products in case of issue. I use their 3/4 NC Stainless Steel version which is identical to solenoids sold by others for twice the price.

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          • #20
            Originally posted by BlackH2O View Post
            This would be a very easy feature to add but how often is the actual system off. I am all over the head brewer if any FV or brite is empty! In the case that you do have a need all that must be done is to add an inexpensive pressure limit switch right before the pressure bypass and connect it to an SSR that powers the pump. Pressure reaches a preset threshold and pump is shut off until the pressure drops due to a call from an FV or brite.
            The other option would be to use a pressure transducer connected to a VFD (need a 3 ph pump) so the pump will speed up or slow down/stop depending on the the pressure in the main and therefore the flow rate required, i.e. Number of tanks cooling increases, pressure drops and pump speeds up to increase flow rate. Then have the releif valve as a redundancy to ensure no over pressure if/when the transducer fails.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by NicaHops View Post
              It also has, after the 3rd fermenter, the Pressure Relief Valve. https://www.mcmaster.com/#adjustable...alves/=17yvazq
              So when any of the valves are open, the PRV would then close so the glycol will be only flowing through the fermenters. When all are closed, the pressure would build up to a certain PSI, open that valve and continue to flow through the loop.
              Rather than spending $300 on a PRV, you can just use a ball valve and pressure gauge. Start the pump with the valve fully open and slowly restrict it until the gauge is reading what you want your "relief" pressure to be.
              Sent from my Microsoft Bob

              Beer is like porn. You can buy it, but it's more fun to make your own.
              seanterrill.com/category/brewing | twomilebrewing.com

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              • #22
                For strainers you'll want 1 big wye strainer near your chiller, that will catch the vast majority of the crap. I don't use any other strainers, but I do keep a ball valve on either side of the solenoid so its easy to isolate and clean without removing it from the lines.
                Manuel

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by mmussen View Post
                  For strainers you'll want 1 big wye strainer near your chiller, that will catch the vast majority of the crap. I don't use any other strainers, but I do keep a ball valve on either side of the solenoid so its easy to isolate and clean without removing it from the lines.
                  For some having one or both manual ball valves on top of the actuated valve seems like overkill but we have a tank offline right now since our installer did not put any manual valves around ours (only manual valve is coming out of header). The diaphragm style actuated valve is not closing fully and overchills the tank. Without the manual valves, there will be expensive glycol loss when fixing the actuated valves. I'm waiting to do some other glycol work before I can shut down and install manual valves on all our tanks.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by mswebb View Post
                    For some having one or both manual ball valves on top of the actuated valve seems like overkill but we have a tank offline right now since our installer did not put any manual valves around ours (only manual valve is coming out of header). The diaphragm style actuated valve is not closing fully and overchills the tank. Without the manual valves, there will be expensive glycol loss when fixing the actuated valves. I'm waiting to do some other glycol work before I can shut down and install manual valves on all our tanks.


                    That does make sense in hindsight having the manual shutoff valves. I don't but when I redo the system for our expansion I will have to. Right now my solenoids are mounted on the high side of the tee so I can actually disconnect it without experiencing any leakage. Granted I have to shut down the pump for a few minutes.

                    The one other thing I had added to the glycol feed line in front of all tanks was a valve that I can connect to low pressure air or CO2 to blow out the system prior to removing a tank or modifying the lines.

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                    • #25
                      Hey guys,

                      We are going to be using insulated sch. 80 for our headers, and I wanted to post a diagram of my planned headers to make sure I haven't over simplified or missed something big. Each dot represents a drop, and I put dots for future expansion as well. I numbered what I thought for there place in the loop (i.e. 8th in is first out). Let me know if this is right or horribly wrong.

                      CheersClick image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2018-04-25 at 5.05.09 PM.png
Views:	2
Size:	71.6 KB
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                      Dustin Baker

                      Owner/Brewer
                      Roadmap Brewing Co.
                      San Antonio, TX

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                      • #26
                        I've seen a couple people on here talk about pressure release valves, does anyone have a good source for them/model number of what they used?

                        Originally posted by DBakes15 View Post
                        Hey guys,

                        We are going to be using insulated sch. 80 for our headers, and I wanted to post a diagram of my planned headers to make sure I haven't over simplified or missed something big. Each dot represents a drop, and I put dots for future expansion as well. I numbered what I thought for there place in the loop (i.e. 8th in is first out). Let me know if this is right or horribly wrong.

                        Cheers[ATTACH]61494[/ATTACH]
                        Dustin Baker

                        Owner/Brewer
                        Roadmap Brewing Co.
                        San Antonio, TX

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by DBakes15 View Post
                          I've seen a couple people on here talk about pressure release valves, does anyone have a good source for them/model number of what they used?
                          Everyone has their own idea about what's best in this situation, but I think what you're looking for is a back pressure regulator. Yes, they're pricey, but manually adjusting a ball valve isn't going to work unattended--too risky IMO, and the pressure will vary all over the place as tanks call for cooling. Furthermore, pressure relief valves should probably not be relieving all the time, and are not designed to maintain back pressure. A back pressure regulator works exactly like a normal regulator, except it measures and controls the upstream pressure.

                          I don't know what your header size is, what type of jackets or what size BPR you need, but this is an example of what I'm talking about. See this McMaster-Carr page.. You can probably find stuff like this on ebay.

                          Some BPRs are designed to go inline, and relieve pressure to an exhaust port when it goes above setpoint. They have 3 ports, so avoid these if you can--I believe they measure from the outlet port, not the inlet port, and they're really more of a pressure relief valve and regulator built together. Something like this might work at the chiller end, where the excess simply exhausts back to the reservoir and there is an orifice at the other end. But the kind that goes at the end of the supply and return lines should have only two ports.

                          If your pump is capable of producing more pressure at shutoff head than your tank jackets can tolerate, you should ALSO put a pressure relief valve in there that can handle your pump's flow at that pressure. Maybe your BPR can handle it, maybe not...it depends on the unit and size, and the pump curve. But a relief valve back at the chiller pump would be a good idea.

                          If you can manage it, it's also a good idea to have the glycol loop shut down unless there is a call for cooling, because pumping glycol around all the time heats it up, and wastes energy. OTOH, that's something you can add later, if needed. If you always expect some demand, then forget about this.

                          Regards,
                          Mike

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                          • #28
                            Originally posted by NicaHops View Post
                            So would I need a manifold for the Out and Return? Is that what people are calling Headers? There is only 1 line IN and line OUT on the unit.

                            Attached is what i drew up today which is similar to my 1st design. but has a bit more to it:
                            There is a manual ball valve before and after each fermenter, this is to lock off a fermenter incase we run into a problem with said fermenter or motorized ball valve. It also has, after the 3rd fermenter, the Pressure Relief Valve. https://www.mcmaster.com/#adjustable...alves/=17yvazq
                            So when any of the valves are open, the PRV would then close so the glycol will be only flowing through the fermenters. When all are closed, the pressure would build up to a certain PSI, open that valve and continue to flow through the loop.[ATTACH]48802[/ATTACH]
                            Which of the 2 PRV's from that link did you end up using? Also how did you determine the line pressure to set it to open the PRV to open for continuous flow? I have the foxx 3/4 & a 1/2 hp chillers & updating my glycol lines.

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