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Thread: Beer Stone in BBT

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    2

    Beer Stone in BBT

    Hi everyone!

    We have a BBT tank appears to have beer stone (correct me if I'm wrong).
    I have run out of ideas, we have runned many cycles of chlorinated caustic, nitric acid and phosphoric acid.
    Concentrations were 4-5% for 60min.
    After 2 cycles we used only the acids for about 5 times more, we used cold and hot temperatures also.

    I have some samples that can give you an idea.

    After the first CIP
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/YaDeg6SNjv9evktE2

    Later
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/PsSNPJNvPeXUsaAl2
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/tDewhvr4OUAPCNVE3

    And finally we got there
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/4Ckpa9p8BKONSvcY2

    The organics seems to cleaned out nice.

    But I'm guessing the rest won't come off with CIP.

    How bad is it?
    Maybe scrub it by hand, with what?

    Any opinions would be great.
    Attached Images Attached Images      

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Dallas, Bangalore and soon Goa
    Posts
    108
    Definitely looks like beer stone (calcium oxalate) to me.

    As a heads up, this can happen when using certain caustic cleaners in a co2 rich environment. Make sure you purge your tank of any co2 before your caustic cycles. Co2 will also reduce the effectiveness of your caustic by up to 50%.

    I would suggest looking at the Birko Corp website and following Dana Johnsons procedure of running an acid cycle, no rinse, followed by caustic. He also outlines this method in the July/August edition of New Brewer. This is supposed to help loosen strong protein bonds and help you remove stuck stuff. Or give him a call/email. He is very good.

    I found this method to be highly effective, but I have only used it for tough kettle, mash, & lauter deposits and not for calcium oxalate. The same theory should still apply as the calcium oxalate is bound with strong proteins.

    Your other option is to run the acid cycle (nitric/phos) for much longer than an hour. I would suggest avoiding scrubbing the tanks as you are likely to scratch them and make a place for bacteria to harbor.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Florence, Alabama
    Posts
    562
    I 2nd calling Dana at BIRKO. Show him the pics and ask for procedure on how to handle it.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Louisville, KY
    Posts
    871
    Looks like scaling to me. The locations are very telling. Beer stone is not picky about where it forms. I have seen the whole inside of a tanks covered in it. The locations you have it happening look to be weld/polish points. Is this an imported tank? I have seen many imported tanks rust up like that due to poor quality stainless and poor passivation.
    Joel Halbleib
    COO / Zymurgist
    Goodwood Brewing Co
    636 East Main St
    Louisville, KY
    goodwood.beer

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    15
    Well, this should be beer stone or calcium oxalate as it should otherwise come out with the acids and concentrations you used. Beer stone can be stubborn. I would recommend a dedicated beer stone removal cycle using a special beer stone remover. Call or e-mail me and I will send you product info.
    Dirk Loeffler
    Technical Director
    Loeffler Chemical is Corp.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Loeffler Chemical Corporation
    (404) 629-0999
    800-769-5020 (US & Canada only)
    www.loefflerchemical.com

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    406
    As a heads up, this can happen when using certain caustic cleaners in a co2 rich environment. Make sure you purge your tank of any co2 before your caustic cycles. Co2 will also reduce the effectiveness of your caustic by up to 50%.


    BINGO, thats the problem had an issue with that in 1 of our tanks. We eventually got all the stone out but it left a permanent mark, the only way to get that out is to have it polished out and I wasnt going to pay for that. Flushing that CO2 out is important
    Mike Eme
    Brewmaster
    Cheboygan Brewery
    Cheboygan Michigan

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