Massive Efficiency Problem

[portagebeer]

We purchased a Stout 5BBL mash tun a few months back, and are currently hovering around 60% efficiency, consistently. It's a terrible problem, I know, and we haven't had time to sit down and address it. Any help or consulting on the issue would be appreciated.

Some background on our process:
1) We consistently use a sieve to measure our crush.
1) Once milling, we use a Monster Mill MM-2 Pro (6" roller) and due to its slow speeds, are forced to pre-mill into the mash tun and bottom fill from our HLT. I know using a grist hydrator is ideal, and this could be the source of the problem, but we haven't been able to rig anything up and would likely need to swap out our mill.
2) The false bottom we have is letting a lot of husks through the filter. Vorlauf can go sometimes up to an hour and usually fails to clear up. We use a secondary mesh filter during our sparge to catch the final husks that make it through.

I'm curious if anyone has had similar issues, or know of ways to help increase our efficiency. My assumption is that bottom filling is the problem.

Any ideas or leads would be super helpful.

Thanks,

Jeff
Portage Brewing Co.

[Crosley]

We purchased a Stout 5BBL mash tun a few months back, and are currently hovering around 60% efficiency, consistently. It's a terrible problem, I know, and we haven't had time to sit down and address it. Any help or consulting on the issue would be appreciated.

Some background on our process:
1) We consistently use a sieve to measure our crush.
1) Once milling, we use a Monster Mill MM-2 Pro (6" roller) and due to its slow speeds, are forced to pre-mill into the mash tun and bottom fill from our HLT. I know using a grist hydrator is ideal, and this could be the source of the problem, but we haven't been able to rig anything up and would likely need to swap out our mill.
2) The false bottom we have is letting a lot of husks through the filter. Vorlauf can go sometimes up to an hour and usually fails to clear up. We use a secondary mesh filter during our sparge to catch the final husks that make it through.

I'm curious if anyone has had similar issues, or know of ways to help increase our efficiency. My assumption is that bottom filling is the problem.

Any ideas or leads would be super helpful.

Thanks,

Jeff
Portage Brewing Co.

Why don't you just mill into trash cans and then dump them in as you fill. I have a 3bbl Stout system. I have it setup to transfer from the HLT to the MT through the top port. I just add bags at a time.
The false bottom is pretty crappy on that system. I hook up an old keg to the bottom outlet. Let the mash sit for 30 and then vorlauf through the keg for 30 and its pretty clear.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[mswebb]

We have a 1Bbl stout as our pilot and have no issue with the screen and vorlauf. Clear in mere minutes. Your mash should be doing most of the filter work and could benefit from rice hulls if you need more bulk.

Definitely mill into containers and pour in over the top. Stir with a paddle (canoe paddle will do) as you mix. The brewery down the road from us is having mill issues and they come down to use ours. They are 7Bbl and it's not that big an issue to mash in. Our 15Bbl uses an auger to hopper above the mash then a hydrator on the way down to the tun with rakes in the tun for a consistent bed level.

[StoutTanks]

Hi Jeff,

Karen here from Stout Tanks and Kettles. We noticed your posting and wanted to make sure you get all the help and support you need to solve this issue. Jabien, your Stout Tanks sales rep, has already contacted you by e-mail. He can offer all sorts of support and advice. Please reach out to us via phone or email anytime with any and all your concerns and questions. We look forward to getting your questions resolved.

[JustinL]

hydrator

We have a 7bbl Stout system. the mash tun is the worst design. I assume you have the same 1/2" gap all around the screen? I buy premilled and used to load bag by bag. I would allow about an inch of water collect above screen then started dropping bags in while the water flowed in. mixing after each bag. We eventually got an auger and purchased a custom hydrator from Bennet Forgeworks. Been great being able to load grist and let it run.

However I found runoff terrible no matter what. I started getting rice hulls and would fill the gap and layer some on the screens then add water. This partially worked. I also got a mesh filter( i think the 150) and started using that. I would attach that after vorlauf only for runoff. Works decently but still when I go to clean out mash tun the amount of mush under screens is terrible. I know someone else with a 5bbl Stout and they got a rubber cord from mcmaster and stuff that in the gap.

All around can't wait to move on to another system

Justin

[portagebeer]

Issue Solved

Hi Jeff,

Karen here from Stout Tanks and Kettles. We noticed your posting and wanted to make sure you get all the help and support you need to solve this issue. Jabien, your Stout Tanks sales rep, has already contacted you by e-mail. He can offer all sorts of support and advice. Please reach out to us via phone or email anytime with any and all your concerns and questions. We look forward to getting your questions resolved.

After some consultation with Stout, we did find that our mash filter was bent severely in three places - hence the creation of channeling around the outside of our tun, during sparge. I worked our manufacturer Stout, to get a prompt replacement (free of charge under our warranty), with an updated design that includes a rubber gasket to ensure a tight seal. Due to this fact, I think we'll be able to fix the solution for good.

As for pre-milling and bottom filling, I've done this for years, know of other brewers who do the same (on our scale or less), and haven't had major efficiency issues. With a good stirring process, we're always able to break down any dough balls. Mash times may take a bit longer, but our current brewing schedule, using cans to manually pour over top is not an option for us (I'd rather purchase a better mill if need be).

We'll see how the new filter works, but channeling during sparge seems to be my current theory for low efficiency.
Thanks all.

-J

[StoutTanks]

Hi Justin,

I'm sorry to hear about your issues.

We changed our 7 bbl mash tun design a few years ago - the gap has been eliminated. That said, we shipped quite a few mash tuns like yours and have not received feedback like yours before. Perhaps it is a specific issue with your tun. Without knowing more, there may be ways to improve the performance of your tun - please feel free to reach out to discuss specifics.

Cheers,

John/Stout Tanks and Kettles