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Am I killing my head retention in the boil kettle?

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  • Am I killing my head retention in the boil kettle?

    I have a two beers that don't have the head retention that I would like to see, so trying to rule out a few things.
    Both of them have a good amount (anywhere between 5 and 15%) of white wheat and caramel, so I wouldn't think this would be the issue. I use a 100 gallon BK heated with electric elements, and as my wort comes to a boil, I get a huge amount of very thick foam, that is probably anywhere from 6-10 inches thick, so I turn the elements way down, then back up ,and maybe stir a little to get it to go down. This can go on for about 10 min or so before I feel comfortable to throw in my 60 min hop additions and proceed with the boil. Could this be killing a lot of the head retention in my final beer, or should I concentrate elsewhere?

    Thanks

  • #2
    Originally posted by Onebadsc View Post
    I have a two beers that don't have the head retention that I would like to see, so trying to rule out a few things.
    Both of them have a good amount (anywhere between 5 and 15%) of white wheat and caramel, so I wouldn't think this would be the issue. I use a 100 gallon BK heated with electric elements, and as my wort comes to a boil, I get a huge amount of very thick foam, that is probably anywhere from 6-10 inches thick, so I turn the elements way down, then back up ,and maybe stir a little to get it to go down. This can go on for about 10 min or so before I feel comfortable to throw in my 60 min hop additions and proceed with the boil. Could this be killing a lot of the head retention in my final beer, or should I concentrate elsewhere?

    Thanks
    Are your beer glasses clean? Enough carbonation? Using dish soap to clean your glasses? Those could impact head retention.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Onebadsc View Post
      I have a two beers that don't have the head retention that I would like to see, so trying to rule out a few things.
      Both of them have a good amount (anywhere between 5 and 15%) of white wheat and caramel, so I wouldn't think this would be the issue. I use a 100 gallon BK heated with electric elements, and as my wort comes to a boil, I get a huge amount of very thick foam, that is probably anywhere from 6-10 inches thick, so I turn the elements way down, then back up ,and maybe stir a little to get it to go down. This can go on for about 10 min or so before I feel comfortable to throw in my 60 min hop additions and proceed with the boil. Could this be killing a lot of the head retention in my final beer, or should I concentrate elsewhere?

      Thanks
      Concentrate elsewhere

      Comment


      • #4
        Beer only wants to foam up one time post ferment. If you beat it with a pump (or cavitate) or have too high a differential pressure between two tanks during a transfer you will beat the head out of your beer. Cheers
        Joel Halbleib
        Partner / Zymurgist
        Hive and Barrel Meadery
        6302 Old La Grange Rd
        Crestwood, KY
        www.hiveandbarrel.com

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        • #5
          This is all in kegs that go to a few different accounts. I was hoping that the foam in the boil was contributing because I'm not sure how much different I can do the rest of my steps. I will briefly tell you what I'm doing and maybe someone can find an issue.

          Once the boil is complete, I stir it manually to get a small whirlpool going, let it sit for about 20 min, I then pump it about 25 feet away through my small plate chiller into my FV while inline oxygenating.

          After fermentation is complete, I pressurize the FV with a few psi of co2, then cold crash it down to about 38 deg f. A few days later, I purge the brite tank, and transfer over using co2. Once filled, I charge up the head pressure, then start carbonating via air stone through a flow meter.

          Once carbonation is complete my brite is around 15 psi (at 38 deg f), I get my sixtels, charge all of them up to 10 psi (these are at room temp because I dont have a walk in cooler). I connect my filler/cleaning coupler (no FOB just valves on it). I keep the gas out closed, slowly open liquid in valve, to start filling, then once it slows I crack open the gas out to keep the keg filling. I keep charging the brite tank every so often to keep it around to slightly above the keg pressure. I fill pretty slowly until foam start coming out of the tube attached to the gas out, I let foam come out for 5 -10 seconds then close everything. I do sometimes open the gas valve more once foam starts, and sometimes I see clearer beer, but I never really see clear beer come out, just seems to waste more beer. I don't recall off hand the empty weight of the kegs, but final weight is usually around 57 lbs, sometimes a little more, sometimes a little less.

          I realize filling part of the process is probably not ideal, but I am working on getting our chiller setup to bring the bright tank a little lower so that I can get my pressure down closer to 13 psi.

          I welcome any suggestions,
          Thanks.

          Comment


          • #6
            I would take steps to ensure you are foaming less in your transferring, carbonating and filling operations.

            - Is the beer cold when it goes into the brite tank and carbonation begins? If it's not at its target temp and you are blasting CO2 through a stone it could be foaming a lot and denaturing your proteins rather than being absorbed as carbonation.
            - Get your kegs closer to your brite tank's pressure when kegging. If there is too much of a differential, especially with a sixth barrel, you could be 1/2 full and have a big head of foam in the keg before you start bleeding off pressure to finish filling. You will have to fight that foam the rest of the fill. We have test-filled a 1/6bbl glass observation keg a couple times and even a 2 - 3psi difference between keg pressure and tank pressure will put a substantial amount of beer into the keg before it equilizes...and it puts it in there FAST, creating foam in the process. Your hydrostatic pressure from the height of your tanks will play into this more/less as well. Sounds like less in your case.
            - If your full kegs are ending up at different weights I think that is a big indicator that you are foaming during filling. Either slow down or adjust temp/pressure of the system.

            Lastly, you could also incorporate an anti-foam agent in your boil kettle. I doubt that is where you are destrying a bunch of proteins, but it could rule out that portion of the process + make your life easier by avoiding boil-overs.

            Hope this helps!
            -Tom

            Comment


            • #7
              Check you mash temps. with a small mash tun, ~100 gallons weve seen 5 degree drops from mash in temps that caused a lack of head for us on some beers. Getting into the 140-145s can be less ideal for keeping head protein.
              If you have a grant between your tun and kettle measure the temp of the mid-first runnings in the grant: that should give you a good idea of temp loss and any stratification.

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