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Thread: Carbonating through the bottom port.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    4

    Carbonating through the bottom port.

    I'm pretty sure this doesn't work but can I place a carbonating stone in a tee at the bottom drain port of a serving tank? The tank I have has only a perlick and bottom drain. I assume since there is little beer contact with the stone I won't get much CO2 in solution. I have been carbonating in the FV but still need to tweak it.
    David Wollner
    Willimantic Brewing Company
    [url]www.willibrew.com[/url]

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Helena, Montana
    Posts
    292
    David,

    In my experience it does not work. I tried it several times years ago to no avail. If the tank is a single wall model, the easiest solution is to have a sanitary welder install another tri-clover port on the tank.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    san diego, ca.
    Posts
    185
    I am currently a bright tank short so I am doing this. Works, not as well as I would like. It is slow and seems to waste some Co2. But I couldn't get a BT in time to meet demand so in a pinch whatcha going to do?

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Syracuse NY USA
    Posts
    182
    I tried carbonating from the bottom of a serving tank and it wasn't working. So I hooked a site glass up to it with the stone inside so I could see what was happening. The glass only filled half way with beer, them when I turned on the co2 it pushed all the beer out of the glass. I thought this was odd cause it dosent happen in the FV. Anyone know whats going on?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    san diego, ca.
    Posts
    185
    I have mine in a pipe attached to the port valve on the bottom of a uni. I turn the Co2 on and open the valve. I can hear the bubbles right away. Since my tank is only rated at 15psi I get it up to 12 or 13 then open the valve in my CIP arm to let some pressure out. It usually takes me few hours and some attention but I have done 3 20bble batches this way. The last batch of hefe I did got up to 2.7 volumes...

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Polson, Montana, USA
    Posts
    1,095
    Hiya',
    I've been carbonating all our products this very way: a carb stone in the "T" connected to the bottom port of the SV. The side port of the "T" has a butterfly valve. I bring the pressure up to about 15psi, tank temp is around 28degrees F and a blow-off hose in a bucket of sani. I get carbonation times (10 bbl) of about 2-3 hours (2.8-3 volumes CO2). Yes, little beer contacts the stone but the CO2 bubbles from the stone make the journey all the way up through the column of beer to the top; head pressure again around 15psi.

    Luck to ya'
    Dave

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    31

    Thumbs up

    I Second what Dave says exactly, it can be done at 60 bbl's I know this first hand and it doesn't take any longer than a side port stone. Use the same prcedure Dave use's and it will work 15 psi head pressure is the key. How are things in Montana Dave? I miss the area, but not my old brewery.

    Mike Hall
    Brewer
    Oskar Blues Brewery
    Lyons, CO
    Mike Hall

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Polson, Montana, USA
    Posts
    1,095
    Good to hear from ya', Mike. You're better off where you are. Although I hear they're looking again!
    Prost!
    Dave

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    31
    Dave I sent you a private message check it out. Mike
    Mike Hall

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Syracuse NY USA
    Posts
    182
    I can picture everything but the blow-off hose. Do you mean at the top of the tank to vent pressure once it exceeds 15 psi? And what is the purpose of the butterfly on the T. Would a cap work just as well?

    Tim Butler
    Head Brewer
    Empire Brewing Co., Syracuse NY

    PS I was just drinkin some Dales Pale Ale today at the Blue Tusk. Have been sippin on it for a while here in The 'Cuse. Met Wayne a few months ago. Give him a shout out for me.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2002
    Posts
    31

    Talking

    Tim, I'll give a shout out to Wayne for ya. as far as the blow-off goes Im not sure, as far as the valve I asume its for packaging. I put our tee off the valve so I could remove the carb stone asembly after carbonation. I only did this once at OB due to the fact the side port carb stone was not functioning properly. the 15 PSI head helps the beer reach its Co2 saturation point alot faster. hope that helps. I have a few brewer friends in Longmont Colorado that work at the Pump House Brewery from the Cuse area we went to the Rocky's sweep of the Yanks series together last week, good for me bad for them but we still had a blast in the Sand Lot at Coors Field.
    Mike Hall

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Seattle, WA
    Posts
    197

    head Pressure is key?

    Hey guys,
    So head pressure is key when force carbonating in this "t" method? Either pressure from the weight of beer on the stone or or gas pressure. Has anyone ever tried carbonating with a stone in "T" arrangement as the beer is activly flowing through the "T"? Will this work? St. Pats makes a carb stone inside of a tri-clamp T, will it carbonate the beer in a flow through type arrangement like transfering from fermenter to brite tank?

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Santa Rosa CA USA
    Posts
    962
    I have done this for years and found that a sightglass is pretty much necessary for accuracy. If I put an elbow on the tank bottom, and the stone in the sightglass at the end of that; when the elbow is tweaked to about 45 degrees then you can see the bubbles rise up into the tank and fresh beer seep down to fill in...thus not getting the stone airlogged which just makes a few huge useless bubbles.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    san diego, ca.
    Posts
    185
    I use the blow-off hose in case of foaming mostly. Think of it as an airlock or sorts. My procedure takes me longer since my tanks are rated at 15 psi I don't like to push that envelope and I can't get my tanks much below 32F.

    As far as in line yes it works great! I used to do this at Millstream. Just have an in line "T'" and use alot of pressure. It is very easy to overe carb this way. I used the sample valve and a Zahm to test half way thru to see if i needed to lower or higher the psi. =)

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Polson, Montana, USA
    Posts
    1,095
    I put a valve on the side of the T and then a Perlick faucet on the valve (I like to isolate as much as I can with valves). I use the Perlick to check carbonation with my Zahm & Nagel, periodically. I attach a hose on the CIP arm that comes from the top of the SV. This hose then goes into a bucket of sanitizer (yep, think airlock). The SV head pressure is held around 15 psi, the carb stone psi is around the same; I'm shooting to establish a dynamic equilibrium. The keys are: pressure in equals pressure out, get beer as cold as possible (without freezing), quality carbonating equipment like Zahm & Nagel. I've also found that filtered beer carbonates quicker than unfiltered. Hope this helps.

    Prost!
    Dave

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