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  • Head Space

    I am wondering what kind of equipment is out there to measure how much oxygen or other gases are in the headspace of packaged beer. I know I can use an orbisphere, but I was wondering if there is anything else or anything cheaper I may be able to use. Thanks for your help.

  • #2
    Zahm-Nagel series 7000 air tester is probably the cheapest.
    Cheers & I'm out!
    David R. Pierce
    NABC & Bank Street Brewhouse
    POB 343
    New Albany, IN 47151

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    • #3
      Originally posted by beertje46
      Zahm-Nagel series 7000 air tester is probably the cheapest.


      But, is it also the best???

      Fred

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Fred Scheer
        But, is it also the best???

        Fred
        I can't attest that it's the best but it is time honored, accurate, affordable, and somewhat bulky to use.

        (KSbrew criteria was cheaper, not best)
        Cheers & I'm out!
        David R. Pierce
        NABC & Bank Street Brewhouse
        POB 343
        New Albany, IN 47151

        Comment


        • #5
          I don't know how the Zahm unit can determine O2 content in the headspace, alone. Its just a piercing device. Your results will be from both the headspace and the product.
          On low speed can lines you can use the Zahm and a special test to check headspace air. Its called the "saltwater test". Will provide instructions on request.

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          • #6
            These Zahms are caustic-filled jars with pipettes for gases NOT reacted with caustic? Those were our benchmark when I packaged in bottles--don't know why they wouldn't be now. I now package in cans and don't have a Zahm piercer for the canning rig. I know I should have. Again, at the risk of sounding repetitive, If it works use it. As long as you can track tendencies; even with (or better with) subjective senses. Oxygen isn't IMHO best picked up by an Orbisphere, Zahm, or other gadget, but by YOU (sometimes many, many months later in the package). The Zahm tester is your best bet to get it on day one. And be aware of CO2 stratification in tanks that seem like they're ready to package. Your Zahm will go nuts and so will you. "Seemed good at first, but then... " Roll your contents gently so it's uniform and all ready to go. Cheers!
            Phillip Kelm--Palau Brewing Company Manager--

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            • #7
              Phillip;

              You are canning commercially and you are not checking for package air?
              Shame on you. You don't know what you are producing. Get yourself a Zahm piercing device and use it.

              What will happen if your undercover gasser quits on you or, maybe, gets lazy on you? You'll be running beer with 20 mls of air until the cows come home. Your QC notification will be all those cards, letters and calls from irate, former customers.

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              • #8
                But I do know what I'm producing. I'm just not measuring it quantitatively. That's my point. I'm using my own senses to judge airs. With a Cask manual filler, I know when the purge is working and when it's not. I can hear the valve open and I can hear the gas spill into the can. I taste the results from every run at least once a week. Our beers aren't on the market very long either. I know where they are, and how old they are. We sell a great product. Lack of "irate, former customers" has me in the clear. Unless you're willing to give me a Zahm piercer (that would be so cool!), we'll continue doing what we do best.
                Phillip Kelm--Palau Brewing Company Manager--

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                • #9
                  The quality and taste gods appear to be blessing you. But this will not last forever. When things are going GOOD, you need to know what normal is. Then, when inevitable problems arise you'll be able to figure out what has changed. Right now, you don't know what package air normal is. You don't know what your baseline is.

                  Why don't you send some samples to a fellow brewer and find out what kind of airs you are running? Just be sure the checks are done with a piercing device that uses caustic to absorb CO2. If the tests are done with an Orbisphere type O2 analyzer you'll get false low values because disolved oxygen readings get lower over time and are next to useless 24 hours after packaging.

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                  • #10
                    Know any fellow brewers within 1,000 miles of Palau with a Zahm?
                    Phillip Kelm--Palau Brewing Company Manager--

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                    • #11
                      Can anyone, anywhere, help Phillip by air testing a few of his samples? I'm sure Phillip will also provide samples for "taste test analysis."
                      Or, perhaps, you have a Zahm piercing device gathering dust that you could loan or give to Phillip.

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                      • #12
                        There are a number of new oxygen testers out which are claimed to be far more stable, and cheaper to purchase and maintain than the membrane types such as Orbisphere. I know of Haffmans and Anton Paar. I am pretty sure Mettler Toledo also do bench test kit.

                        They all use membrane free technology. No personal experience yet.

                        Cheers
                        dick

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                        • #13
                          As Dick Murton says, there are a number of instruments for oxygen measurement.

                          Rather than pay big money for a package analyser, I would suggest buying a normal, portable O2 meter and a piercer for sampling in package. Work as follows:

                          Take two bottles straight off the filler, shake ONE for a minute or so (doesn't need to be a violent shake, gentle rocking will be fine) but NOT the other.

                          Using the sampler hooked-up to your O2 meter, measure the dissolved O2 in both the shaken and unshaken bottles and interpret the results as follows:

                          Both results low: Good O2 in the beer, good O2 control at fill;
                          Low unshaken, high shaken: Good O2 in the beer, poor O2 control at fill;
                          High unshaken, high shaken (both similar): Poor O2 in the beer , good O2 control at fill;
                          High unshaken, very high shaken: Poor O2 in the beer, poor O2 control at fill.

                          Yes, this won't actually give you headspace O2, but WILL give you a good - and cost-effective - way to check your beer and filler process.

                          Hope that helps!

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                          • #14
                            We have been using the method recommended by KWLSD utilizing an Orbisphere O2 meter. We have found good results that relate well to the real-world conditons, such as high total package O2 (the result of shaking the beer) correlating with bad fobbing on the filler.

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                            • #15
                              Thanks MJM

                              Being a pragmatist at heart, my view has always been that a test should be simple, repeatable, cheap and easy to interpret.

                              What really matters is being able to see what your process is doing and locate any issues that may arise.

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