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  • DO meter

    I am trying to justify getting a DO meter for my brewery. My new boss tells me that at 15,000 bbl a year we are too small for such an expensive piece of equipment.
    My old boss tells me that the DO meter is to the filter man what yeast counting is to the brewer. He knows that I would not brew with out counting the pitch rate and viability of my yeast.
    Where do other brewers way in on this?
    I would also like to be able to measure the PPM of O2 in my wort….

  • #2
    You are way past the production level were I would have bought one. 15,000 bbls. And too cheap to commit to the qualtity of your product. Sad. Your old boss had sound advice.
    Cheers!
    David R. Pierce

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    • #3
      is there a brand or model you recomend?

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      • #4
        We bought an orbisphere for around 3k from a guy here on the forum who reconditions them. Very happy with it and with his service. I think his username is KWLSM. You could probably do a search on DO Meters and find him in a post.

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        • #5
          Consider getting one of the optical units rather than membrane units if you can afford to buy new, and afford the extra. It won't be long befopre they stop doing the membrane ones anyway, in my opinion. Lots of decent suppliers - Hach (orbisphere) Mettler Toledo, Centec, Haffmans,and Anton Paar (probably got theirs sorted by now) that I know of.
          dick

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          • #6
            So, is the general consensus that at 15,000 bbl we should have a DO meter? Can I get a link to one of those reconditioned units?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by squiggy
              So, is the general consensus that at 15,000 bbl we should have a DO meter? Can I get a link to one of those reconditioned units?
              Yes. You need one. User kwlsm, the used guy, doesn't exist anymore or the search can't find. Google.
              Cheers!
              David R. Pierce

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              • #8
                you definitely need one at that size. the orbisphere is easy to use and the most widely used DO meters in the brewing world but they are'nt great for reading DO in wort. Best used for reading off the filter, bright tanks, and packaged products. Wort will toast the membranes, and i never could seem to get an accurate reading from wort. We've been using an optical one on loan for wort D
                O readings. we got an orbisphere at the brewery I used to work at for like 1500 bucks on eBay that worked fine....you just have to search for the deals.

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                • #9
                  KWLSD here

                  Buster - thanks for the nice words - it's always good to hear our services are appreciated!

                  Dick - I wouldn't write off membrane systems just yet...I know you're a fan of optical but I'm yet to be convinced entirely for brewing applications.

                  We're trying as hard as we can to get hold of some more meters and I'll keep you all updated.

                  A good portable meter has the benefit it can be used for pretty-much everything, from wort O2 to final pack.

                  We do have some nice inline kit though if anyone is looking to measure at fixed points ( Am I allowed to say that?)
                  Last edited by TL Services; 01-18-2011, 02:09 PM.

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                  • #10
                    "We do have some nice inline kit though if anyone is looking to measure at fixed points ( Am I allowed to say that?)"

                    Why not ?

                    One of the particular reasons I like the optical systems is that if the process system suffers pressure shocks, (which we all know shouldn't happen), or particularly slight vacuums, the membrane systems can rapidly lose their membrane seal integrity, allowing beer / wort behind the membrane, diluting the electrolyte.

                    We have also picked up oxygen ingress spikes on the optical sensors which we couldn't identify clearly with the membrane systems due to their slow response times (though it has to be said a bit of physical walking the process route would have picked it up after knowing there was a system problem)

                    But I agree that the membranes will probably be around for a few years yet
                    dick

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                    • #11
                      Dick - I just didn't want to sound like I was overtly advertising my wares

                      I quite agree that pressure shocks shouldn't be there - apart from the effect on meters, etc. they're also a nightmare for opening pipeline joints, probably causing the DO2 spikes you were seeing!

                      The problems of membrane lift/electrolyte contamination are minimal these days to be honest - current sensors all use o-rings under the membrane and it's best practice to use a perforated grille over the end to (a) prevent debris damaging the membrane and (b) prevent excessive membrane lift should the unit be exposed to low pressure in the line.

                      The other difficulty with optical systems is that you need a whole new system (meter + sensor) if you're upgrading an existing installation, whereas a new EC (membrane) sensor will run with an existing meter - thus saving $$$$/££££'s.

                      That must be a good thing in these financially-challenged times

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                      • #12
                        I wouldn't worry about the advertising aspect - you are giveing good generic advice as well

                        Unfortunately we STILL have problems with mebrane / seal rupture, but as far as most views of this site are concerned, this wouldn't be an issue. After all I am talking about cahnging flow rates from 400 to 600 hl / hr dropping rapidly to zero with the line open ended say 5 metres below the supply before the valves close to prevent pipe hammer - but creating the effect of a vacuum instead - hend the wrecked membranes

                        And yes, the instruments I have used are part of a new install, but I understand AB-Inbev & Coors (UK ops) are starting progressive replacement of membranes with optical

                        But generally, I do agree with your assessment of the replacement costs
                        dick

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                        • #13
                          Dick - I'd welcome the opportunity to take a look at your systems - to see if there's anything we can do to reduce the problems you're having.

                          I'm aware there are some inroads for optical in the UK market, but they're still in the minority.

                          It remains to be seen what Mettler do with their new, membrane-based acquisition...

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                          • #14
                            Can either of you recommend a unit on this side of the pond?
                            Joel Halbleib
                            Partner / Zymurgist
                            Hive and Barrel Meadery
                            6302 Old La Grange Rd
                            Crestwood, KY
                            www.hiveandbarrel.com

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                            • #15
                              For good, reliable use and pretty-much bomb-proof build, then an Orbisphere 3650 is the meter.

                              There are other portables - Mettler make a small, lightweight unit that's quite handy, for example.

                              Don't bother looking at the units you see on eBay and places - they're designed for measuring high levels (ie. in the ppm range) in water courses, etc. so are unlikely to give the sort of resolution/accuracy needed in brewing (under 0.5ppm/500ppb).

                              Hope that helps!

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