Mash ready adjunts

[dvarga]

Been using the following adjuncts in my French Blanche:

Toasted Wheat Flakes (~35% of total grist); typical analysis is about 80% efficiency.
Mash Ready Corn Flakes (~15% of total grist); typcial analysis is about 82% efficiency.

Been running them through the mill...yea I know...not supposed to, but it mixes better with the base malt.

I have been finding that the total amount of extract is always about 200L less than if I were brewing with malt alone.
(2200L (adjuncts) instead of 2400L (malt only)).

Is there some trick to using mash ready wheat and corn?
Does it need a longer time to hydrate to allow for conversion? 20 min to mash in; current times for rests are 20 min each for Beta and Alpha rests; and 5 min rest at mash off.
Does it need more mash liquor to hydrate?
Should I switch to raw wheat instead? That is the traditional way to do it, but I am concerned I will kill my mill. We have a 2 roller Engl mill that does a pretty darn good job.
Can raw wheat convert directly with the barley malt or does it need a seperate mash cooker until the starches expand and then add the barley malt to get conversion?

At a loss to figure out why this is happening.
Any thoughts are appreciated.

[Bainbridge]

Are you using rice hulls to help the lauter?

[Beer_Nut]

What temp are you mashing in? Typically for a wheat beer you would mash in around 130F and step up to 149-152F. I would try that and see if your efficiency improves at all. The gelatinization temp of wheat is lower than barley so you don't have to worry about using a cereal cooker. Corn has a much higher gelatinization temp than barley but if you are using mash ready corn, you should be fine. Definitely use rice hulls if you are using raw wheat....I had an 8 hour lauter once when using raw wheat.

[kai]

Raw wheat will convert at normal sacch temperatures, but I doubt switching to it would help your efficiency.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but adding together the flaked wheat and corn you are using, you've got half your grist as adjunct. That's pretty epic.

I'd guess that the problem may stem from one of two areas. Either incomplete conversion from too much adjunct and not enough malt (iodine test ok?), or poor lautering from insufficient hull material (spent grain bed look ok?).

[dvarga]

Not using rice hulls; no difference with or without
Have manometer tubes measuring above and below plates. Very little difference.

Rests at 140-147ºF; 158-162ºF; Mash off at 167ºF

Added additional pils malt; however, I have not done an iodine test in a while, will try that again; having said that...
Starting gravity: 1.050 SG/12.5ºP
Finishing gravity: 1.010 SG / 2.5ºP

Anybody out there has had poorer extract with mash ready/ flaked adjuncts?

Thanks for the input...appreciated.