HLT and CLT?

[HBC2193]

Hi all,

I'm planning to open a 10bbl brewpub that will twice per week during our first year or two. Questions....

Will a 10bbl Hot Liquor Tank suffice? Do I need a larger one?

Do I need a Cold Liquor Tank? I see a lot of brewery without them but manufacturers of course suggest them. What do I gain/loss with a CLT?

I plan to keg directly off 4 x 10bbl unitanks. Is it even work getting a single bright tank for occasional transfers and such?

Steve

[NHBrewer23]

Hi Steve,

Cold Liquor Tanks are essential in areas where the city water does not stay below 50 degrees year-round. With a CLT, you can bring your water down to 38 degrees or so and cut down on your water usage as it will take less water to chill your wort.

Another option is to use a two stage heat-exchanger and use the street water to knock down the wort temperature where then your glycol system can finish off the cooling. The downside to this setup is that it places a considerable load on your glycol compressor and if you don't have enough cooling capacity, you will shorten the lifespan of your chiller. Plus, you will be using more electricity to chill the glycol.

Having worked in VA, I know the water gets warm in the summer. You will want a CLT.

As for the bright tank, if you save room for one and stub your glycol supply so that you can add a bright if need be, you can try and get away without a bright. You may find that your beers aren't dropping bright enough and may need the bright. A bright tank will also increase your production capacity. Having to tie up a fermenter to wait for the beer and drop bright enough to carbonate and package from will cut down the number of turns you'll be able to get from your tanks. Not to mention, managing your yeast will be challenging if your fermenters are tied up.

[TGTimm]

As the writer above stated, the need for a CLT largely depends on the temperature of your domestic water supply, and the efficiency of your heat exchanger (HX). We don't use one, but our water remains below 50 F year-'round, and we have an over-sized HX.

For your HLT, it largely depends on how fast it can heat water, but there are other considerations. Our cooling water exits the HX at about 140F, so we use an HL return tank to store for heating in our HLT. Sizing your HLT to accept the waste water from the HX saves quite a bit of money, both in saved water and electricity (gas) to heat it.

[dick murton]

Assuming you are using chilled liquor in a single stage heat exchanger, you are likely to use somewhere between 1.2 and 1.3 times the wort volume, depending on the chilled water temperature and PHE efficiency. Personally I would go for something larger than that, say 1.5 time the wort volume as this allows you to produce larger volumes of more dilute wort should you ever want / need to. But mainly because is is a real pain to run out of chilled water.

Again, for the hot liquor tank, you will want something of similar size to the cold liquor tank. You always produce a larger volume of hot water than wort, and the excess is then available for preheating the mash tun, CIP etc. If you get a larger tank, you don't have to fill it, but it gives you a bit of flexibility for little extra cost.

Make sure the both have CIP facilities, i.e. a suitably sized sprayhead and ability to link the outlet to a scavenge pump.

[wailingguitar]

CLT is nice, but I think you can get away without it in 95% if brewpub situations. I am in Alabama and I don't even have one in our production brewery (10bbl). I am using a 2 stage HeatEx, but rather than using glycol directly to chill the second stage, the cool out water goes through a small heated and is prettied with glycol. In the winter I can knock out in as little as 25 minutes when the ground water is very cold, in the heat of summer I was seeing about 40 minute times when the ground water got warm.

10bbl heat ex is acceptable for a 10bbl brewpub situation as long as you aren't trying to double brew. Our brewhouse was intended for a pub situation and has only a 10bbl HLT, we have to make due. I had a gas fired on demand heater added and my SOP is to run 185F water in for 15min after I mash in. It runs about 3gpm @ 185F. When I am double brewing, however, I run the on demand into the HLT up through the 1st sparge and it will get filled a little while into the 1st boil and be ready for the 2nd mash in which occurs about 15 or 20 minutes before 1st WP. When the HLT gets replenished with the knock out water it is still at a good temp to sparge number 2.