odd sparging problem

[mr.jay]

The following has happened to me the past 3 brews. Different beers, different grains. I mash, I rest, I vorlauf a minimum of 15 minutes (or until the wort runs as clear as beer itself), just as I have done a countless number of times. I begin sparging. I tend to my other brewhouse tasks, and occasionaly check on it's progress. About 1/2 hour into the sparge, from out of nowhere, I watch as oodles of particulate matter swims through the sight glass. The first time, I stopped, underlet, stirred the mash, rested, and recirculated with success. The second time, I waited it out, and it ran clear after about 15 minutes. Today, the same thing. What gives! I don't think I'm doing anything differently than I did before.

[RobZamites]

Are you starting to sparge as soon as you get a clear wort in the sight glass from your vorlauf? I'm doing my second brew today (I learned lots about my system from the first time out, believe me ), and after a longer vorlauf, I'll be running off into the kettle at a very slow rate until the liquid line goes just below the grain bed, then batch sparge and slowly increase the runoff rate. I'll let you know how it goes.
As an aside, I guess I didn't have the CIP spray ball in my MLT fastened all the way down, so when I tried to use that to sparge, the ball shot off like a missile into the middle of my mash!

[Brew49411]

You don't want to have to direct of a stream of water when sparging. Check and make sure that your cip is not plugged. If you have to direct of a stream of water, it just drills its way through the grain and creates the problem you stated, grain flowing into the mash. Try to vorlauf for 20 minutes. Thats how long I normally use. That could help also.

[beauxman]

I second the suggestion about the integrity of your mash bed. I would suspect some channeling is going on and you are not getting the proper natural filration from the mash. Do you find that your extract effeciency also goes down?

[RobZamites]

Well, my methodology worked like a charm, after a 20 minute vorlauf, and a "kinder gentler" run-off I got a huge extract
Longer vorlauf, gentle start to the run-off and make sure you have a good filter bed set seems to be the trick. Good luck, Mr. Jay!

[Michael Murphy]

Sounds like your losing the suction, the loose particles under the false bottom are getting lifted and run into the grant, could be your milling, could be from over stirring the mash, or having channels or low bed depth in areas of the mash bed.

On your next batch, mash in carefully and stir less as possible, when you begin to recirculate or sparge, just stir the top portion of the mash to level the bed. Make sure to keep an inch of sparge water at all times over the grain bed.

[tariq khan]

Vorlauf ?

Hey would somebody please tell me what is "Vorlauf" ?
Is it the recirc of the mash before running off ?

Thanks

Tariq (Dark Star Brewery(

[steved]

Hey would somebody please tell me what is "Vorlauf" ?
Is it the recirc of the mash before running off ?

Thanks

Tariq (Dark Star Brewery(

Yep. That's exactly what it is.

[tariq khan]

Vorlauf ?

Thanks a bunch !!!

T

[beertje46]

Not exactly...

Yep. That's exactly what it is.

It is the recirculation of sweet liquor, not mash per se.

[BeersmithMT]

It is a method of filtration that recirculates the sweet liquor through the grain bed (of the mash). If my memory from living in Germany serves me correct, I believe it translates to "run before", or "run in front".

[Sir Brewsalot]

Going back to your original question here...

During my recirc, I often notice an acculumlation of solids on the bottom of my grant. (10bbl brewhouse, maybe a 16 gallon grant if this matters) It stays put thru the entire recirc, and then into the runoff, depending on the level in the grant, I can get the same thing you're describing, as these solids made their way to the exit of the grant.

My solution: Before valving to runoff, drain the grant completely to run this stuff back to the grain bed where it belongs (I speed up the pump instead of closing the mash tun exit, but that's just my system.)

Once it's out, let the grant refiill, and then start your runoff. Maybe 5 minutes more time tops - less if you do it before things run clear.

Let us know what works!

Cheers,
Scott

[Sauce]

The same thing happens with most of my runoffs that Jay speaks of.
We have combi tank so the mashtunn sits on the liquor tank. I've just chalked it up to temperature changes to the mashtunn bottom as the liquor level lowers loosening any grain that has settled on the cone.

I havnt found anyway to eliminate this issue, I just closely monitor my grant and I have a piece of screen I put in the grant before I start running over. I basically do what Sir Brewsalot discribes then I incert the screen. Later in the mash when I notice the particulate in the grant I cutoff the runnoff, drain the grant completey then rince out the screen and remove any remaining grain from the grant.

One other thing I tried to do was to do a couple "power flushes" into the grant early on once the level was above the inlet. I do this to try and wash out any grain that might be collecting on the bottom before it gets too settled in. I just open the valve "quickly" wide open. Be quick, and only once or twice, because this will compress your grain bed a bit.

JackK

[davidmeyers]

What is the purpose of a grant cylindar as part of the vorlauf/sparge cycle? How does it really serve the brewer's purpose? The guys who designed the system I brew on put it before the sight glass and valve. The previous place I brewed it was opposite that (after the sight tube and valve). The previos brewer said it makes a big difference. How and why!

[Sauce]

Not sure what your talking about with the sight galss and all but ere is my take on the grants purpose....

A. allows the mashtun to drain with gravity as apposed to having a direct connection to your pump. A direct line from your mashtunn to your pump would create too much suction comressing your grain bed.

B. Allows the brewer to observe the clarity of the runnoff....I'm guessing that is what the sight glass is for on your system?

On ours system there is a valve before the gran allowing you to regulate the speed of your runnoff...obviously I would think this is pretty standard.

JackK