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  • Plate and Frame Filter Techniques

    Howdy all,
    I've been having sporadic success with my 40x40 plate and frame using 700Seitz pads, 10 bbl, all ales, several days of fv cold temps. What techniques (tank pressures, blow-off yeast, soaking filter, etc) has everyone found success with to maximize yield, reduce waste, and keep the filter time under eight hours?!

    Prost!
    Dave
    Glacier Brewing Company
    406-883-2595
    info@glacierbrewing.com

    "who said what now?"

  • #2
    first, I have never done this by myself. but from what I remember seeing this done...

    1) assemble the system.
    2) hot water through-- fill all space-- open all vents, close them one by one from the inlet side.
    3) steam sterilization-- push out all water-- open all vents to get rid of water and sterilize fittings, starting from the outlet side. keep steam going for 15 min.
    4) cold water through-- cooling the system down, prime the lines/pump.
    5) DE pre-coat
    6) Beer in, fine DE dose
    7) discard void-volume water, beer to BBT.

    I don't remember the pressures... someone please help!
    I think the pressure is about 40~50 psi before the filter, and about 20 psi pressure drop (??).

    coarse DE pre-coat is about 1kg per 1 m^2 filter surface (we used less)
    fine DE is about 100g per bbl, plus or minus, depending on the beer.

    with this set up, we managed to filter about 10 bbl in less than 3hr.

    Comment


    • #3
      Hello Dave,

      Hope you are well. If it is taking you anything over an hour to filter 10 BBL, something is not right. We used to do 7 BBL in 20-30 min, and 10 in well, 45 to an hour. The key to smooth plate and frame filtering is perfiltration yeast removal. Not being familiar with the Sietz, what micron rating is the 700? A shot of yeast early will really bind up a plate and frame.

      We used to transfer from FV to CT adding finings during the transfer. Wait one to two days for the beer to drop bright, then filter into BT for serving / kegging / bottling. We would prep the filter with a cold water rinse, followed by a sanitizing loop of very low pH water created with food grade phosphoric acid and pushed out with more water. We would discard the pads after each use. I found sanitizing with excessively hot water would tend to degrade the pads, as would an overly long acid cycle. Or really any waiting around with wet pads.

      If I filter now (which is rare), I like to avoid animal products, so after a stay in oak, say two to six weeks (or much, much longer) I rack into a CT, chill, run through the filter, and viola. Bright beer.

      You need to try to remove as much yeast as possible. Fine beer if you are so inclined. Rack through racking arm if you have one. Blow yeast plug. Blow it again. Go like the wind.

      Please feel free to give me a call if you would like to discuss in more detail.

      Cheers,
      Ron
      Jolly Pumpkin Artisan Ales
      734-426-4962

      Comment


      • #4
        Seitz 700 has a rating of 5-7 microns. If it's taking 8 hours to filter through something that coarse, somthing is seriously wrong. I'm filtering 15 bbls. through a 2.5 micron filter in a little over an hour. I agree with Ron that removing as much of the yeast as possible is key. I think you must be sucking up a big yeast plug early in your filter and that's binding up the filter. On the other hand, 5-7 microns is kind of hard to plug up unless it's a tremendous amount of yeast.
        Scott Isham
        Harper's Brewpub

        Comment


        • #5
          Yeast is more in likely the issue, I have been using a sheet filter for quite some time now, it has its days but normaly I can filter 50hl in a few hours in a 90 plate 40x40. my filter has a diverter and I use rough sheets in the first half and fine sheets on the back end.
          Its very important the pressures on the filter, sheets should have a recomendation for the pressure of the flow. as well as the back pressure, I like to let the whole system fermenter-filter-bbt equalize in pressure before blowing off the back presure. I use the valves at first to control the back pressure out of the filter, I want to see all the manometers running about equal as well as see the beer flowing brite.

          When you filter you may find it helpful to make a filter log, using a graph with volume (cm on level glass and time) plus any notes, backflushes, sheets, pressures etc.

          How does the filter look when you break it down is it complete gunked up with yeast or has the beer and leftovers penetrated the sheets deep, leaving a almost clean plate behind?

          M process:
          1. load the sheets (many sheets are directional front to back)
          2. I push 85C water through the whole line and filter for about 5 mins (200-300lts (bigger filter more water))
          3. I use CO2 to push all the water out of the hot filter.
          4. Slowly allow the beer to push in the filter, I bleed out any remaing water with the beer and once its beer open the tank to receive.
          5. I use pressure to push the beer through, after about 30% I can start to use a pump, I rarely use a pump however, I just balance the pressures and it flows quite well.

          I usually can filter 2-4 tanks (50hl each with the same sheets).

          Other problems could be a result of the wort production, protiens as well as non floculating yeast are many times wort or even water issues. Try to use a kettle finning and see if that helps, make sure the water has enough calcium to aid the yeast to drop well.
          www.Lervig.no

          Comment


          • #6
            Jarviw, Ron, Scott, and Michael;
            THANK YOU ALL for the insighful feedback.
            To answer Michael's question: when I'm done, the filter pads are very saturated. There is almost no yeast on the plates. Currently, I'm pushing with around 25 plates (that is how many came with this used filter). Any ideas where I can get more plates?
            Dave
            Glacier Brewing Company
            406-883-2595
            info@glacierbrewing.com

            "who said what now?"

            Comment


            • #7
              Plates are not hard to find if your filter is recently built, but there's no standard from one company to other as how the plates fit on the railing guide (hooks)


              Zb

              Comment


              • #8
                More plates aren't the answer. 25 is enough. What type of yeast are you using?
                Scott Isham
                Harper's Brewpub

                Comment


                • #9
                  I'm using a german ale yeast.
                  Glacier Brewing Company
                  406-883-2595
                  info@glacierbrewing.com

                  "who said what now?"

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Filter Update!!!

                    Okay, for those of you who have been holding their breath.....
                    My previous (last 2 months) filters have been nightmares! 8 hours long, multiple back-flushes, etc. I filtered a batch of ale today with a new batch of my yeast. The session was about one hour and 45 minutes! NO back-flushes, no real problems! I think my other yeast was just too old. The old yeast bogged down the filtration matrix, almost binding it. New yeast let everything flow just fine!
                    Note to self: Order yeast more often!
                    Glacier Brewing Company
                    406-883-2595
                    info@glacierbrewing.com

                    "who said what now?"

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Great news! Your feedback/follow up is (will be) much apreciated


                      Zb

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        filtering dramas

                        I agree with the previous posters.
                        I have a 40 x 40 plate and frame filter too, and my filtering runs, even for a 15bbl double batch never take more than 1 1/2-2 hours. Even when I have filtered my hefeweizen which has really flocculant yeast, its still way quicker than 8 hours.
                        I use Seitz 200 sheets, which are 2 micron.
                        Make sure your sheets are in the right way, rough side towards to the flow.
                        I always start my pump off slowly and then increase the rate as the sheets begin to clog up.

                        Allan
                        Tanglehead

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          plate and frame filtering

                          I have also had sporadic results with plate and frame filtering. The only thing I can think of doing is to do yeast cell counts on the beer before filtering and then if filtering goes well use that as a standard for how bright a beer needs to be to filter smoothly. Do most of you filter beer that is already bright or very nearly bright?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Since I started this post I have learned/discovered quite a bit about plate and frame technique. I crash the temp of the beer in the FV for at least 1.5 days before the filter. I use K300, which gives me a nice, bright beer. The key aspect is that I equalize the system: FV, hoses, pump, filter, BBV. This really is the key. Using this technique, I went from average 5-6 HOUR filters (10 bbl) to 28 minutes. You need to monitor your filter inlet and outlet pressures. If there is ever a difference of 2 bar between them, purge the filter of beer via CO2, then back-flush with cold liquor initially then hot liquor then cold again.
                            Hope this helps you.

                            Prost!
                            Dave
                            Glacier Brewing Company
                            406-883-2595
                            info@glacierbrewing.com

                            "who said what now?"

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by GlacierBrewing
                              If there is ever a difference of 2 bar between them, purge the filter of beer via CO2, then back-flush with cold liquor initially then hot liquor then cold again.
                              Hum? Interesting. This would be counterflow I imagine, to relase yeast and not forcing it through?

                              Zb

                              PS: now that we've switched from HS4000 to HS1000 (by error) we've solved our problem. The beer is super clean and we've cut the time in half.

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