Nano Canning Line Suggestions and Feedback

[Mike-CCSA]

We have been brewing on a small 1 BBL brewhouse for 3 years, as a taproom only, with the occassional keg to local restaurants, but it is time we started a small canning operation to better support our non-local customers. Problem is, there are a lot of small canning systems and of course all of the online marketing materials makes each system look like the Holy Grail of canning lines.


Our ideal canning system would handle up to 15 cans per minute (to allow for growth), counter pressure fill, have the ability to date/code cans, apply labels, be fully automated, have a compact footprint, operate off of single phase 120V/240V, support at least 12oz/16oz cans and can ideally be operated by one person. It would need to support filling from a Brite tank or a Keg. I've read several stories about trying to fill from a keg and they have been horrible experiences.


Looking for feedback from users of any of the below systems on my list, or if I have missed one that you think should be on my list, please let me know. Would like to hear about Reliability, Customer Service, Parts Availability, Ease of Use, Required Installation Items, Preparation Effort, Cleanup Effort, etc…


I've been on all of the manufacturers web sites and YouTube and several forums researching Pros/Cons of the systems, but would like to hear from ACTUAL owners of any of these systems.

• CASK Global Canning Solutions
  • Nano ACS
• ALPHA Brewing Operations
  • Compass 25 Compact Canner
• INNOVUS Engineering
  • CF10 Canning Machine
• ABE Beverage Equipment
  • CraftCan ISO16 Counter Pressure Filler
  • CraftCan15 Canning System
• CANO
  • CANO System
• TWIN MONKEYS
  • The MANCOS
  • The MANCO CP
• MICROCANNER Automated Beverage Canners
  • MC ATOMIC
• XpressFill
  • XF4500C Counter Pressure Filler
• Fillmore Packaging Solutions
  • 4 Head Can Filler – Counter Pressure
• CODI Craft Canning System
  • CCL-45 Filler
• WILD GOOSE FILLING
  • Wild Goose Fusion Counter Pressure Filler
• AMERICAN CANNING
  • CP-4 FILLER / SEAMER
• Pneumatic Scale Angelus
  • CB50C Counter-pressure filler/seamer
• Shuohua
  • SH9/2 Can Filler-Seamer
• Brewman Machinery
  • FBCS1-1 Flash Boy Canning System

[Brewman]

Hi Mike,

We also have canning machine, please contact with us for a quotation if you are interest:-)

Cheers,
Brewman Machinery Equipment Co.

[Mike-CCSA]

I'll have a look at what you guys offer...

But I'm actually just trying to narrow down my current list to the top three, based on my feedback request. There are a ot of canning lines out there, surely folks have one that is on the list they would like to talk about.

[jndsn402]

I have the XF4500C Counter Pressure Filler. Going down your list of preferred features:

handle up to 15 cans per minute (to allow for growth) - no. I struggle to get to 2 cans per minute. Typically I average 80 cans per hour.
counter pressure fill - yes. many of the smaller lines do not counterpressure fill so this is a plus.
have the ability to date/code cans, apply labels - no, you will need separate equipment for this. You will also need a separate seamer.
be fully automated - somewhat, you put the cans in and flip the switch to fill. Filling stops automatically and you pull the cans out.
have a compact footprint - yes, very compact. Fits on a tabletop and takes up maybe 18 inches by 18 inches.
operate off of single phase 120V/240V - yes
support at least 12oz/16oz cans - yes
can ideally be operated by one person - yes
It would need to support filling from a Brite tank or a Keg - yes

I will also say this is probably your least expensive option by far.

[Mike-CCSA]

Thanks for the info on the XF4500C, I've read posts about this unit and the struggles some have had here: Canning Discussion



What has your experience been?

[jndsn402]

I can't speak to issues with oxidation as I am canning soda not beer. I think because of the soda's low pH there is not as much oxidation. As far as the canning itself I have no complaints, it's just fairly slow.

[AGB]

Thanks for the info on the XF4500C, I've read posts about this unit and the struggles some have had here: Canning Discussion



What has your experience been?

I have a 4500C and at first I had a bit of difficulty with it but then, it just clicked. As jndsn402 said, you won't be able to fill 15/min. I get the best results canning from a brite tank with the head pressure around 10psi. I also turn up the CO2 going into the filler to 15-20psi. But I just can't get cans for a decent price.

[CCS]

Hi Mike,
Please reach out to
sheila.christian@canadiancraftsolutions.com
I would be happy to provide feedback and information that will be of value about our Canning/Packaging Line.

[danibier]

Hi, check out these systems:

https://www.danisbrewtower.com/danicanfiller-model2

https://www.danisbrewtower.com/danicanfiller-model3

[Blu Dragonfly]

If you are still on a one barrel system, I'd recommend the Xpressfill 4500C and an Oktober seamer. It takes us about 1 1/2 hours to do a 10 case run. Our package volume is increasing so we've purchased a DK canner/bottler and will eventually surplus our Xpressfill. On the Xpressfill with two people, 4-6 cans a minute is realistic depending on how highly carbonated the beer is you are canning. That set up should come in at less than $8000. I've seen the used price people are asking for other manual systems and $15-$16K is ridiculous. I'm not noticing oxidation in our cans up to three months. We've got some ales we've packaged further back and still no signs of oxidation. One thing I've loved about this system is you can adjust the counter-pressure on the fly very easily, plus they send you a clear can to set your counter-pressure to the amount of foam you want to see. For your size, I wouldn't recommend anything larger or more expensive, this will do all you need to do for tap room can sales in a smaller brewery.

[drbenj1]

We have the MC Atomic from Microcanner and it really works great. It has a tiny foot print which is great for us because we are limited on space. Easy, and quick setup and cleanup. Can do 10 cases in about 50 minutes. Very simple machine that is easy to understand.

We also have the ABE Craftcan 15 which is also very nice and easy to use. We get closer to 25 cpm with it. Takes a bit longer to setup and cleanup but we can do 7bbls in about 1.5 hours.

Both are great machines but we use the microcanner more right now just because it is easy to setup and we don't have the cold storage to store all of the cans right now from the ABE machine.

[caitisullivan]

Hi! I'm researching small lines and I'm really interested in the Atomic. I'm curious if you could speak to TPO numbers at all? I have heard great things about other MC units but there doesn't seem to be much out there about the Atomic - I've gotten burned by using an Xpressfill so trying to do some homework before our next machine. That said, a small machine would definitely be a great solution at my brewery.

[microcanner]

Its about the same as our other line, 24 - 38 PPB pick up from tank.

We also have a new model called the SWIFT. 32k and does 20 CPM.

Atomic - 10 CPM
Swift- 20 CPM
Flex- 30 CPM
Craft- 38 CPM
Max- 60 CPM

https://www.microcanner.com

[CerberusServices]

Hey Mike,

I hope that the fine folks above were able to get you the help you needed. In case you're still open to more options, here's some further info and recommendations for ya -

- The Wild Goose Fusion is a good option, although it has a bit of a learning curve. One major upside to it is that it supports both Atmospheric/Gravity AND Counterpressure filling via two separate modes. They also own the patents on the Meheen counterpressure systems which have been around since the early 90's.

- Because you're asking for a counterpressure line, I imagine that it's in order to keep your DO levels low. Gravity fillers can do a pretty good job of this, too. It just takes a little know-how of filling practices to achieve low ppb in cans consistently, mainly through optimal temp, pressure, carb level, and cap-on-foam. However, if you're going to be primarily working with higher carb'd products (2.7 v/v and up), then counterpressure will definitely be your best bet.

- It is a giant pain to package off of kegs, but not impossible. It is imperative to keep the kegs COLD and the distance short between the keg(s) and the filling machine. It is also possible to daisy-chain kegs together to get more throughput. The more heads the system has, the harder it may be to achieve this. Also, packaging off of kegs with a counterpressure line can be more difficult than a gravity filler as counterpressure lines use sensors that detect variations in pressure. These sensors try to automatically adjust for these variations and achieve a target pressure in the cans before off-gassing. Filling from kegs can lead to wild pressure fluctuations which can confuse the counterpressure systems. If using a counterpressure line is imperative for you, I would suggest using something along the lines of a Unitank if you need a smaller profile and mobile option compared to a brite tank.

If you think that atmospheric/gravity filling might be a good option for you, then I would suggest Wild Goose's Gosling table-top system. It is a single head filler and has an output of around 9-10 CPM on average for 12oz cans. Their flagship Evolution (EVO) series has a larger form factor, has a mobile option, and can support multiple heads, even with the ability to increase the number of heads via a few extra pieces and with easy adjustability. I have personally seen a 5-head model kick out 50 CPM of 16oz cans. It was hot-rodded a bit to make that happen (average is about 30 CPM), but it was a thing of beauty.

I hope this info is helpful to you! Feel free to give me a shout if you have any questions - abennett@cerberusservicesllc.com.

Cheers!!

- - Edit: I can definitely speak more to cleaning, reliability, customer support, and any other questions you may have about the products I've mentioned above. If you're interested in learning more, please feel free to contact me.- -

[workhorsecanning]

You might also consider the Workhorse 24, 24 cpm, Canadian made, affordable, single part time operator. https://www.workhorsecanning.com/workhorse-canner , https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9Q4ahMpAfY&t=3s

[workhorsecanning]

You might also consider the Workhorse 24, 24 cpm, Canadian made, affordable, single part time operator. https://www.workhorsecanning.com/workhorse-canner