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  • White Labs WLP 051 - help

    I have been using this yeast in all my ales for about three months now. I have noticed that it is very sensitve to cool temperatures ( below 70) and is very tempermental with high gravity beers, anything over 16 plato. I have fermented two brews over 16, one at 18 and currently one at 20. the 18 plato beer took twelve days to reach a terminal gravity of 4.7. The 20 plato beer is still fermenting on day five at 11.5 plato, dropping 1 degree per day at this time.

    The beer that took twelve days to ferment had no off flavors and was a great beer. But 12 days is rediculous. I pitched about 6.5 gallons of yeast into a 20 bbl batch harvested out of the cone of the previous brew.

    I aerated for the entire pump in, which took about 35 minutes.
    Added 25 grams of servomyces to the boil
    plenty of calcium available to the yeast.
    An all malt brew - no sugar additions

    has any one used this yeast and had similar results. It is noted for being less attenuative, but the fermentation times are way to long. Even my 13 plato beers are taking 7 days to reach terminal gravity.


    any suggestions other than changing yeast strains would be appreciated.

    thanks,
    Scott
    Cheers,

    Scott Vaccaro
    Captain Lawrence Brewing CO
    Elmsford, NY
    www.CaptainLawrenceBrewing.com

  • #2
    Scotty,
    I have used that strain in the past and 12 days does seem extremely long. My feeling is that you aren't pitching enough yeast for 20bbls. I have a 15bbl system,I recall having to pitch only 5 gallons one time, it took a couple days to even get going and fermentation took over a week as well. Without knowing cell counts ect. I would think you just don't have enough yeast cells to get the job done. Just my two cents.
    Cheers,
    Mike Roy
    Brewmaster
    Franklins Restaurant, Brewery & General Store
    5123 Baltimore Ave
    Hyattsville,MD 20781
    301-927-2740

    Franklinsbrewery.com
    @franklinsbrwry
    facebook.com/franklinsbrewery

    Comment


    • #3
      Wlp 051

      I would tend to agree with the above post- underpitching. I use the Wyeast 1272, which is the corollary to the WLP 051, according to White Labs. I am pitching about 10 gals. for 20 Bbls, and it is usually done in 5-7 days. I have made beers in the 8% ABV before with no problems, and it ferments well in its range of 60-72 degrees. According to the White Labs catalog, the WLP 051 is tolerant to 8-12% alcohol. I haven't tried it because the 1272 works so well, I figure if it ain't broke, don't fix it. Hope this helps; even though you don't want to switch, maybe try it once and see if it affects the flavor? I would be curious to know.

      Good Luck!
      Paul Thomas
      Brewer
      Sockeye Brewing
      www.sockeyebrew.com

      Comment


      • #4
        I recently switched to WLP051 from WLP001 as a trial and I to have noticed slower ferments when compared to 01. I have not done a high gravity yet but my standard beers 11.5 - 14P take about three days longer. They really seem to drag for the last few days. I pitch between 5-7 gallons into 15 Bbls. The beers all taste fine they just take longer. I even bumped up the O2 and yeast pitch and let them ferment at 70F. The higher temp doesnt seem to make much difference. WLP001 was always completely done in four days fermenting at 68F. Its good to know someone else has noticed the same thing, I was starting to look for unexplained variables. I haven't talked to Whitelabs about it because so far it hasn't really been a problem but maybe we should give them a call to see what they say, they are always helpful and interested to hear about their yeast.
        Big Willey
        "You are what you is." FZ

        Comment


        • #5
          You pretty much summed up my experiences with the yeast. The fermentations take at least 6 days some times up to 9, with no off flavors or negative qualities. I have been pitching 10 gallons to a 40bbl batch and 6.5 gallons to a 20bbl batch. The fermenation always seems to take off quickly, lag times less than 18 hours, but then by day 4 it just slows down.

          The 20 plato beer i am fermenting right now started up quickly but is now just puttering along. It is clearly still active, and steadlity fermenting away - slowly.

          On day 7 the gravity was at 9.8 plato. I have let the temp creep up to 74F because i don;t want to shock the yeast into falling asleep on me. Last time i fermented this same beer it took 12 days. The beer was great, no off flavors and very clean, but 12 days is too long.

          I have almost had it with this yeast. Maybe i will give it one more shot.

          Scott
          Cheers,

          Scott Vaccaro
          Captain Lawrence Brewing CO
          Elmsford, NY
          www.CaptainLawrenceBrewing.com

          Comment


          • #6
            Remember also that 20P is a big f'ing beer! the 001/56 is an agressive attenuator, is very alcohol resistant, and rips through about anything you give it. The new strain won't attenuate quite as much. You swithed for a reason, right? Looking for more esters?
            Larry Horwitz

            Comment


            • #7
              I started right out of the gate with 051 for increased esters and increased flocculation because we are not filtering, only fining. (we have only been open 4 months) I will say that the floculation is no better than my past experience with 01/1056 so i may end up switching over. I just switched finings as well from gelatin to isinglass and it seems to work a lot better.

              Scott
              Cheers,

              Scott Vaccaro
              Captain Lawrence Brewing CO
              Elmsford, NY
              www.CaptainLawrenceBrewing.com

              Comment


              • #8
                Remember, as a rule fast floccing yeast under attenuates (compared to non-droppers) and makes more D...or doesn't reduce it. 56 usually drops fairly fast...

                Why aren't you filtering? Style? $$$$?
                Larry Horwitz

                Comment


                • #9
                  I use Wyeast 1272 as my primary house strain and see it hit the final grav in as little as 3 days, but I overpitch a bit...I also don't filter - and believe that it is not required for what I'm doing here. Time and temp do nicely for me, though early on in my operations, things weren't so "bright".

                  Cheers,
                  Scott

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I used to use the Wyeast 1272 with similar results. I wanted to switch over to Whitelabs because i like them, and they provide great service. I am thinking about switching back. This is the second "batch" of the 051 that i bought from whitelabs, after the first poor performance I wanted to give it another chance, but got identical results.

                    Scott
                    Cheers,

                    Scott Vaccaro
                    Captain Lawrence Brewing CO
                    Elmsford, NY
                    www.CaptainLawrenceBrewing.com

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yeast

                      I am at the end of the useful life for the WLP051 and it never changed, always a slow ferment with good results and good fininshing gravities. I did a 23P Barley Wine called Omen Ale (brewed on 6/6/6) as the final pitch and six days later it is creeping along at 12.5P it really slowed at day 3. It is still going but I am worried. I know this is a huge beer but I remember my01 ripping right through it and also wyeast 1007 at another brewery I worked at. I pitched 10 gallons into 10BBls and Oxygenated the hell out of it as well as adding servo so I'll let you know what hapens. I would like to get down to around 5P but we will see. Im tempted to add another strain but all I have is a Belgian Wit at the moment. By the way I am switching back to WLP001.
                      Big Willey
                      "You are what you is." FZ

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Wlp051

                        Well i had enough with the WLP051 after the last batch of 20P beer took 12 days to ferment out to a final gravity of 5.5P, higher than expected. I gave it a second chance when i reordered it after the first 10 brews, hoping it was just a weak culture - no such luck. I have made the switch to wyeast 1272 American Ale II with great results. The first batch fermented with a 20bbl pitchable fermented out in 6 days, the second brew - a 19P beer was done in 4 days.

                        I love the people and service from whitelabs and i will continue to use there WLP530, which I think is a great yeast, but the WLP 051 just didn't do the job for me, twice.

                        Scott
                        Cheers,

                        Scott Vaccaro
                        Captain Lawrence Brewing CO
                        Elmsford, NY
                        www.CaptainLawrenceBrewing.com

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Wlp051

                          Thanks for the updates, Scott. I almost switched a few months back, and after reading these posts I am glad I stayed with the Wyeast 1272. BTW, I have used a few of the White Labs strains here in the past year for specialty beers, and none of them performed as well as the Wyeast strains I used to use; they were all slow starters, and very sensitive to temperature changes listed in their parameters. Nothing against White Labs, but I think I will stick with Wyeast, I have always been happy with the yeast and services they provide. Good Thread!
                          Paul Thomas
                          Brewer
                          Sockeye Brewing
                          www.sockeyebrew.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            White labs

                            I do have to mention in defense of Whitelabs that the WLP001 that I have usually used is a great yeast, very consistent with good everything, never a problem. I also used their Dry English Ale and Sanfran Lager with very good results as well as a few Belgians. I have also bumped up from a single homebrew vial a few times and had good results. I believe this particular strain of theirs 1051 is simply a slow yeast, not a bad yeast just a slow one which depending on your situation could be a problem. I enjoyed the flavor profile I just dont like the long ferments. Does anyone out there like the performance of this strain?
                            Big Willey
                            "You are what you is." FZ

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I agree with you 100%. The yeast made some great beers, no off flavors, consistent quality, it just took to long to do the job. I will say that it seemed to weaken as the generations progressed.

                              I have been using their WLP 530 with great success, I love it.

                              Scott
                              Cheers,

                              Scott Vaccaro
                              Captain Lawrence Brewing CO
                              Elmsford, NY
                              www.CaptainLawrenceBrewing.com

                              Comment

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