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  • irishsnake
    replied
    I agree with previous posters on the wheat beer - 8% wheat does not make a wheat. I've not been particularly satisfied with dry yeast, either. As to the hops, though, really I see little point in adding hops anywhere but the beginning of the boil (for bitterness), or the end of the boil (to capture volatile flavor/aroma compounds). I've played around (a lot) with mid-boil hop additions and have found no impact of use in beer flavor.

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  • callmetim
    replied
    I believe it has to be 40% wheat to be labeled a wheat beer by the ttb. dry yeast is fine IMHO because its cheap and you can dump it after every batch rather than re-pitching and worrying about your yeast quality. that being said you are limiting yourself to just a couple of varieties. as a start up dry may be good since you're going to have a lot of issues and having an easy yeast may limit your issues. once you're on your feet then start wprking in your lquid yeasts.

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  • TPBC
    replied
    Originally posted by chaser View Post
    ditch the consultant and just hire yourself a good head brewer. or just trust yourself...
    Couldn't say it better myself.

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  • chaser
    replied
    ditch the consultant and just hire yourself a good head brewer. or just trust yourself...

    Leave a comment:


  • Griff
    replied
    It does sound like your consultant is trying to steer you towards what they are comfortable with and not what you want, I'd push for what you want. If you want a proper wheat beer then its going to have to be brewed with a much higher proportion of wheat. Are they also supplying the brewhouse? Maybe they are aware of process limitations with it. If you let them guide you to much then theres the chance that you'll end up with a generic beer that is only slightly different to many that they have put into the market before you, that just leaves branding and marketing to differentiate your product.

    With regard to hop additions for aroma and flavour, there most certainly can be benefit to adding at multiple stages during the boil and not just a single addition towards the end. Its not an exact science due to the complex nature of hop oils but various oxygenated compounds are produced from the essential oils during the boil which survive into beer and which give flavour and aroma. The later the hopping the more of the oils themselves will persist but its only a very small proportion and much is scrubbed by CO2 later, so dry hopping is the way to go if you want those aromas. The kettle will have a major impact on the hops, bittering levels will probably be quite different from what you got during your homebrew tests, you should get much better utilisation with a comercial kettle.

    I'll keep and eye out for your beers, whats the name of the brewery? Good luck!

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  • einhorn
    replied
    Again, a matter of preference. Traditionally a (American) pale ale will have 60/20/5 or KO minute additions, all a matter of taste and how your system performs. Some experts say that if you are dry hopping you don't need late additions. You can create any recipe you want, I think it simply has to taste good and can be scaled up on your system.

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  • kev
    replied
    Sorry, should have been clearer. The hop advice was more for the pale ale and red ale.

    Im going to do a late addition in the wheat, its more american style, but just a small amount

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  • einhorn
    replied
    Guess it depends on the type of wheat beer. Typically, for a German style there are only FWH or 60/70 min. additions, the phenols and esters should be the aroma focus of this style.

    Maybe for a US style you want 5 min. additions. Personally, even with that style, I would stay away from it.

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  • kev
    replied
    Thanks for the feedback, its pretty crucial that the beer taste nice

    The other thing was the hop schedule. He is very against any hop additions other than at the start of the boil for bitterness and then just 5 minutes before the end of the boil for aroma/flavour. I can see a certain logic to this if the aroma from earlier additions will be boiled off, but I wasn't sure if this was the accepted norm or not.

    Its been a busy week of home brewing so I have several variations on the recipes fermenting at the minute, so that should help me get a handle on it as well

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  • ChesterBrew
    replied
    Just dropping in to say I agree with the prior posters... I wouldn't consider something with only 8% wheat a wheat beer -- as Dick Murton said earlier, 40%-50% is where you want to be.

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  • Gansett
    replied
    Time for change

    kkkkk
    Originally posted by kev View Post
    Hi all,
    I'm currently working with a brewing consultant to fine tune my initial recipes for commercial use. In effect taking the tried and tested home brew recipes and modifying them for commercial production.

    Just two things. For our wheat beer I'm being pushed to drop the wheat content to 8%, with the rest being mainly pale ale malt.... Im really not comfortable with that as I was planning on a wheat content of 40%.

    Also in terms of yeast, he is pushing for dried yeast. I can see his point in term,s of ease of use and consistency, but I would prefer to use liquid yeast, as I have found it gives more flavour and a lot of breweries are using the dried stuff.

    I'm torn here between the professional advice and my experience to date so any comments would be great

    thanks

    kevin
    Time to change your consulant
    Brewer for 50 years

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  • schmogger
    replied
    I agree with most of the previous posts. With that in mind I would start to think that your consultant might not be sending you down the right road. I would dig a bit deeper to see what his rational is for the decrease in wheat, and have there been any other red flags that have caught you off guard? As for the yeast it is a personal preference and my preference is liquid.

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  • kev
    replied
    Thanks for all the feedback!

    All going to plan we'll be doing the pilot brews in January!

    Happy Christmas to you all

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  • Natrat
    replied
    For my money (and I don't have much) I agree with most of the previous posters...40% wheat in a wheat beer sounds about right. 10% sounds like head retention or maybe a lame crystal wiess. As for yeast, I prefer liquid yeast. I think that yeast management and successive pitches on yeast through many generations is an essential skill for a brewer. I get the idea of using dry yeast, but in practice I prefer liquid cultures.

    It would be interesting to chat with your consultant, and find out what his brewing background is and his reasons for those proposed changes. Bottom line, though, he works for YOU. So you can just tell him that you want 40% wheat, period, and not even mention your good friends on ProBrewer

    Good Luck! Plenty of second opinions around here!

    Nat

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  • Fausto Yu-Shan
    replied
    Berliner Weisse

    Tried to attached a file (.pdf 3.7 Mb) published by the VLB-Berlin with information and some parameters of the grist composition of a Berliner Weisse in which they may use up to 65-75% wheat malt. IMHO, you may use up to 50% with no problem. If interested, please send me your email so I can send it.

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