draft beer loss, growlers, and keg meters

[redlodgesam]

I just did an analysis of our tap room for January-April of 2014. Pints, growler fills, and freebies entered into our POS registered the equivalent of 45 kegs per month. However the brewery "sold" 65 kegs per month to the tap room. That is a stunning 31% loss.

The cold room is plenty cold, 35F. The kegs are tapped on the other side of the wall from the bar. I recently replaced the beer lines and balanced the system. Pints seem to pour well, we might lose an ounce, tops, on a 16 oz. pour. Growlers have some foaming, but certainly does not seem like 31+%.


So the two culprits would seem to be loss on growlers and/or employee theft.

I have the following questions:

How much loss do you get with draft beer?

Has anyone installed flow meters on their kegs to monitor beer poured versus pint sales entered into the POS. If so, do you have recommendations on keg meters?

Any feedback on the growler fillers on the market? I have looked at Pegas and HDP. I like HDP a little better in that you can just push a button as opposed to having to train bartenders to manipulate valves.

Any feedback is appreciated.

thanks,
sam

[Junkyard]

Growler filling loss is probably more than you think. I would get a counter pressure filler, that will knock the foam and keep your customers happy with more carbonation at the same time.

[jcmcdowell]

Bartenders...

I'm certainly no expert- but I do visit a LOT of Micro's in my life long quest of 'research' as we move to opening possibly the smallest tasting room/nano brewery in Montana.

I'm amazed that some servers wash glasses with beer for re-orders then dump before filling. 2-3 oz per pint down the drain. A glass rinser or simply a new glass would save potentially 20% of the beer.

I also see servers letting growlers just pour pour pour down the drain before they cap it off. Another 3-4 oz per growler.

By the way, Great beer and swanky brewery/restaurant/bar/grounds at Red Lodge

JC McDowell
Bandit Brewing CO in TTB processing...
Darby, MT

[beerguy1]

I kringe everytime I see a growler getting filled as there is always loss and given the cost of IPA it really bothers me. I have seen FOXX taps that have a flow restrictor on them and I wonder if I put one of those on it would fill the growler slower and have less loss anyone use these yet?
I worked a large brew pub we had 32 taps and We put a drum and measured the waste in just 48 hours we over flowed the drum Now, yes some had to be rinse water but none the less huge loss.

Damn growlers. Yes, I know a counter pressure would be good but no room at the current micro

Cheers

[redlodgesam]

I kringe everytime I see a growler getting filled as there is always loss and given the cost of IPA it really bothers me. I have seen FOXX taps that have a flow restrictor on them and I wonder if I put one of those on it would fill the growler slower and have less loss anyone use these yet?
I worked a large brew pub we had 32 taps and We put a drum and measured the waste in just 48 hours we over flowed the drum Now, yes some had to be rinse water but none the less huge loss.

Damn growlers. Yes, I know a counter pressure would be good but no room at the current micro

Cheers

I have played around with various flow restrictor faucets. My experience is that they don't work very well. When I called sales reps to ask if I was doing something wrong, they knew very little about them. They mumble something about them working best for Belgian beers or draft systems that are warm or not properly balanced.

Since I originally posted, I have done the following:
Added a glass rinser that rinses with soft, cold, filtered water to remove dust or cleaning chemicals from glassware and growlers.

Had a training with employees. Even long-term bartenders had some bad pouring habits. I have instructed them to open the faucet, let the first bit of beer that might have been warm in the faucet go and then start filling the glass. Ditto with growlers. Growlers are no longer filled to the very top of the growler.

I fashioned a growler tube that doesn't quite touch the bottom or sidewall of the growler. This seems to allow for the most gentle filling.

On my spreadsheet that tracks unaccounted beer losses, I adjusted the amount in a growler from 64 oz. to 67 oz. 64 oz. in a standard growler does not reach the neck of the growler. Most growler enthusiasts expect the growler to be filled to the neck.

I lowered dispensing PSI by one pound. Most literature on draft systems say to add a pound of dispensing pressure for every 2 feet of elevation from keg to faucet. I assumed that meant the bottom of the keg , but perhaps its the top. The beer seems to pour a little better at the lower pressure.

The unaccounted for losses of beer in May and June were 20%, down from 31% in months prior. An improvement, but still a lot of beer.

I have played around with a Blichmann beer gun and it works pretty well. I would like to build a manifold with Cornelius fittings and a Blichmann beer gun for growler filling, but I haven't had the time.
I also worry about bartenders keeping this kind of set up clean.

As a final note, we have a refrigerated beer trailer for beer festivals, rodeos, etc, that we keep at 32 F (3-4 degrees F colder than our tap room cooler) . We can pour beer from the trailer literally without spilling a drop. The beer seems to dispense more slowly. So I suspect temperature is a big factor and the colder the better.

cheers,

sam

[Aspetz]

balance

Seems like you're dealing with a restriction issue. The math for lift/drop is definitely supposed to be from the bottom of the keg, but it's designed for over restricted systems, and with the cooler right there, you have maybe 4ft, so half a pound is plenty. Through the wall direct draw your beerlines should be at least 7ft of 3/16th vinyl from the shank, then barrier to your panels if you need distance with 3/8th jumpers from kegs. Also getting a gas blender will really help with pouring slower and smoother. But never preblended gas.
Your cooler temp is fine, but sounds like beer at the faucet wants to blow up. Look at building a shadow box and blower to keep your shanks and faucets well chilled.
We install a ton of units for this company

http://usbeveragenet.com

And it's alarming how quickly keg yields go up. It's connected to your pos system and can be set up to alert you via text when a pint has been poured but hasn't been charged within a certain time frame. Generally pouring habits and freebies change in under two weeks.