HDP/Custom Brew Single Head Filler

[martyl]

PLC's

I have seen a couple different PLCs in these depending on how old the unit is. The Custom Brew days ended - what nearly a decade ago??

[HinduKush]

I have seen a couple different PLCs in these depending on how old the unit is. The Custom Brew days ended - what nearly a decade ago??

Mine is a '96 3 head. Brand new though, like finding that classic car in your grandmother's barn with 10k miles.

[jl07960]

Again thanks for the info! Mine is like a '96 I think remember the brewery saying that I got it from.

I'm going to try to work with it in the near future with current configurations but I am sure in the future I will be back with more questions!

My PM if you can send any of that literature is flounderbrewing@gmail.com

Thanks again!

[jl07960]

I'm back

Hey guys,

So finally I got around to firing up the custom brew bottler and have some questions.

I have not run beer through the bottler yet, just water while I am trying to figure it out.

Got air going to the cylinder at about 40 psi
Running CO2 from my tank straight in
Running water from a keg straight in as if it were part of my CIP

The thing turns on fine, CO2 is purging, piston seems to work nice and smooth with the 40PSI air.

Problems:
1) water just keeps runing out of the fill tube even in the up position, just keeps running and running

2) when I put a bottle in and push the start button the piston goes down, purge goes, the light in the background comes on and the fill process seems to want to get going but the bottle doesn't fill (except for that constant stram of water I mentioned earlier) but I would expect the water to fill quicker as if it were filling with beer

I adjusted the knob on the drain outlet to try to adjust the O2/CO2 combination but that didnt seem to do anything

any ideas?

To clarify more from before, it is a single head autpmatic fill, has a PLC inside the side panel, seems to be all configured for my 12 oz bottles which is nice, just doesnt seem to want to fill

any ideas?

any input too on how I would run a CIP versus run a fill? I dont have a switch like someone else mentioned about being able to switch to CIP where it runs freely and run which would run it for filling - it kind of seems like it is in CIP mode right now and maybe thats the problem, is it some combo of buttons I am supposed to push or something?

One note is that I can't get the run light on unless I hold the stop button for a few minutes, perhaps there is some button procedure to switch it between run an CIP?

Thanks!

[Rob Creighton]

Hey Flounder, The Custom brew machines and present day versions are based on the same fundementals but the latest ones have display screens.

Got air going to the cylinder at about 40 psi
My manual requires a 100 psi feed which I run at about 75 psi - the reg going into my machine has red arrow set points on it.

Running CO2 from my tank straight in
Straight into what? The feed pressure on keg should be around 15 psi. The pressure into your machine for pressurizing the bottle must be 2-3 lbs above that.

Running water from a keg straight in as if it were part of my CIP
I use a 5 gal. cleaning can for CIP. 2% caustic solution with warm water first. I use chlorine dioxide as my sanitizer next at 50 ppm with cold water.


Problems:
1) water just keeps runing out of the fill tube even in the up position, just keeps running and running
Is their a CIP cleaning cycle built into the software? Mine runs alternately through the fill line and then the CO2 line. The machine came with a jumper to link the two during CIP. I have rigged a quick disconnect to allow me to just connect and away I go. I don't know how the Custom Brew machine is set up but I can't imagine it is much different than today's machine. Martyl seems to have the exact same as yours and would probably be a better resource but the 40 psi air makes me suspicious

2) when I put a bottle in and push the start button the piston goes down, purge goes, the light in the background comes on and the fill process seems to want to get going but the bottle doesn't fill (except for that constant stram of water I mentioned earlier) but I would expect the water to fill quicker as if it were filling with beer

I adjusted the knob on the drain outlet to try to adjust the O2/CO2 combination but that didnt seem to do anything
The vent line control valve determines how fast liquid will fill the bottle or pass through the machine. Wide open for CIP, close completely and open a little bit at a time to determine beer inlet flow rate. Mine are set about a quarter turn open during beer filling

any ideas?

To clarify more from before, it is a single head autpmatic fill, has a PLC inside the side panel, seems to be all configured for my 12 oz bottles which is nice, just doesnt seem to want to fill

any ideas?

any input too on how I would run a CIP versus run a fill? I dont have a switch like someone else mentioned about being able to switch to CIP where it runs freely and run which would run it for filling - it kind of seems like it is in CIP mode right now and maybe thats the problem, is it some combo of buttons I am supposed to push or something?

One note is that I can't get the run light on unless I hold the stop button for a few minutes, perhaps there is some button procedure to switch it between run an CIP?
I think the Custom Brew machines had a multiple button push system for changing process'. Martyl can probably enlighten you or you could call Heavy Duty Products at 519-740-9499 and press "2" for parts and service. A fellow by the name of Greg Cann can email the manual to you or answer questions. His email is gcann@macdonaldsteel.com

Thanks!

[BrewinLou]

"Running CO2 from my tank straight in
Straight into what? The feed pressure on keg should be around 15 psi. The pressure into your machine for pressurizing the bottle must be 2-3 lbs above that."

Do you have that right? Shouldn't the beer be under a hair more pressure then the bottle? Wouldn't you have co2 pushing beer and co2 all the way back to your keg?

[jl07960]

Sorry I had that backwards, you are right!

I did get a manual from HDP but it only helps to a point, so much is talked about with the digital settings on the machines now that mine doesn't have. I think the main hurdle I have right now is two things

1) what are the button configurations to switch between run and CIP and also does my model use a jumper for CIP like the newer HDP's

and

2) whats the best way to check for a broken solenoid? I want to rule out that in regards to why I continue to have the water coming out of the drip tube no matter what buttons I am pushing - like really freely running out of the drip tube that I can fill a 12 oz bottle quickly without even having to turn the machine on. Leaves me to think I am either stuck in a CIP setting or a solenoid is frozen.

[Rob Creighton]

I know - counter intuitive - the manual recs 30-50 psi feed to the gauge at the machine because some brewers use filters in line and the pressures can get over 20 psi. I found that by having my inlet pressure slightly higher and based on the flowrate I set with the bleed valve, we get a very quiet start from the fill tube and no backing up the line. It was learned just from playing with it.

[Rob Creighton]

Pressing the stop and start switch together or in sequences might control things

1) what are the button configurations to switch between run and CIP and also does my model use a jumper for CIP like the newer HDP's
I can't imagine they made a machine that wouldn't allow you to clean the gas line but I don't know that for sure. Martyl sounds like he is working with a similar machine to yours. He's probably your best resource. I know the machine that I saw at a brew-your-own required you to press two buttons together to get things to change.

2) whats the best way to check for a broken solenoid? I want to rule out that in regards to why I continue to have the water coming out of the drip tube no matter what buttons I am pushing - like really freely running out of the drip tube that I can fill a 12 oz bottle quickly without even having to turn the machine on. Leaves me to think I am either stuck in a CIP setting or a solenoid is frozen.
If you have a light display on your PLC and can get an electrical drawing, you should be able to watch the activated lights and figure if it is enabled or not. A fellow by the name of Mike Osborne at Heavy Duty could guide you through it - if he is still with them

[jl07960]

Doing that definitely effects things but I just dont know how.

If I hold the stop button the piston goes down and the ready light blinks on and off but it sits there (water still leaking out0 not doing anything, CO2 purge is not on at that point) - I think there are definite sequences that can be done but unless someone knows them I doubt there is anyway to actually figure them out.

After holding the stop and the piston goes down and stays down, I can hit the start and the machine starts to make some noises but not sure what it is trying to do. I think this can be something with CIP but again I can't figure out why it is just a constant leak of water through the fill tube no matter what i do. I can't imagine hooking my keg up there and having a constant flow of beer all over my work table.

[martyl]

HDP Help

First, I am not guessing but using a copy of a copy of the original Custom Brew Manual for the HDP PLC controlled Bottle filler and lots of experience.
1.The air pressure for the cylinder is a maximum of 50# - the original user said they found 40# worked best for them.
2. Make sure the door closed sensor is clean and that there is a plastic cap on the door handle bolt above the sensor so it knows the door is closed - do every procedure with the door closed
3. Make sure drain valve is open to about the 11'oclock position - open more as you achieve successful fill of several bottles, until you get maximum flow and just a little foam during END OF FILL
4. Connect air, co2, beer (water) to respective connections
5. Co2 counter pressure should be 2-3 pounds less than keg pressure ( need good guages for both or one good one to calibrate them)
6. Turn power on to unit
7. wait 5 seconds then press stop button twice to release filling head and set system in fill mode
8.Place clean bottle in unit - close door
9. The amber light should be out - if it is not, hold the stop button until it goes out and is ready for filling
8. press the start button and the operation should begin ( do not hold the start button down very long)

Make sure the sensor wires in the top of the filling head are connected and that the sensor is clean - this will give you a successful stop of a fill

The unit will automatically fill 12, 22 and other size bottles with no modification other than having the right spacer for the bottom of the bottle

Selecting the right counter pressure -
1. with door down - press and hold both the start and stop buttons until the amber light flashes - (don't let go of either button yet)
2. count the number of flashes - indicates the counter pressure time
Hand written on a page is
2 flashes 12oz bottles
4 flashes 22oz bottles
This is what I use with successful filling

3. To change counter pressure setting continue to hold the STOP button releasing the START button then press it back in and count the flashes continue this process until you get the number of flashes you want then release both buttons to resume filling operation.

CIP Mode

1. place clean bottle in filler
2. close door
3. Hold down stop button until AMBER light comes on - The filler is now in CIP MODE
4. To perform the short cycle press and quickly release the START button
5. To perform the long cycle press and hold the Start button for 3-4 seconds, release - program is set to 30 minutes
6. To pause either CIP MODE press the STOP button once
7. To clear the CIP MODE - Press and hold STOP button until the amber light goes out
8. Set up for hoses during CIP is in my earlier post in this thread with the Y hose.

Use the short mode - with water, then cleaner, then water - then sanitizer for a quick clean

Use long cycle with 15 gallon keg of cleaner as the time runs 30 minutes - I do this once a week when bottling. I rinse with long cycle hooked to hot water line thenuse sanitizer in short cycle. Make sure the drain valve is wide open during CIP MODES

On bottling day - connect beer line to water first and run the short CIP cycle 2 times, removing bottle and emptying between cycles.

Place bottle back in filler press and hold the STOP button until the Amber light goes out to get out of CIP MOde

Connect beer to the BEER connection - CO2 to CO2 and Air to air

Fill the first bottle and disgard contents - Ready to fill clean bottles

I have some specific tips and tricks for unique problems - email me at -
martylindon@smartenergetics.com with specific questions

[jl07960]

Wow than you! This is aweone, i owe you a beer! Ill get to the brewery after a vacation im going on and give it all a ty, i'll let you know how it goes and if anything comex up. Thanks again!

[yap]

reviving and old one...

I seem to have the same problem as the OP. When I turn it on water just streams out of the fill head no matter whether it is powered on or not. Also, I can't get the machine out of CIP mode. The light just stays on and blinks in and out every 10 seconds or so.

This unit worked when I first got it. I ran tests and figured out proper use. I since tore the machine down, replaced the tubing and cleaned the fill head. Now I have problems. Apparently I didn't put something back together right...

I have the exact same problem on two identical machines....

Did the original poster ever get yours working?

[jl07960]

yes I got mine working, the constant water dipping was a bad solenoid, the valve inside the solenoid was actually broken, when I took the solenoid out I was able to find the model number on e-bay for a replacement and since then it works fine.

[Edward Woods]

Any part numbers for the valve part?