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  • Copper, PVC, or ???

    What are the brewers using for glycol piping? Copper is always expensive especially right now and was wondering what other products brewers are using to supply glycol. All suggestions welcome.

  • #2
    I have always been a big fan of copper for longevity. Copper is spendy and the installation costs can be high, unless you are running it yourself. Cool-Fit ABS is becoming more popular, material costs are similar to copper but, installation is easier. I am not a big fan of PVC as I don't think it has much durability. Try doing a search on this forum, I'm pretty sure there have been previous threads on this subject.

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    • #3
      Its been beat to death, but ABS or Copper.

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi,
        You can use copper, stainless steel, steel or ABS pressure pipe systems (not drain pipe systems) like COOL-FIT ABS and COOL-FIT ABS Plus.
        You can not use PVC because it have a temperature range/ operating range from 32F to 140F and you will be running you glycol at a temperature below 32F. Some PVC manufactures even have the lowest temperature for PVC at 40F.

        Best Regards,

        Dan Stromberg
        GF Piping Systems

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        • #5
          Depending upon the life of your brewery... Schedule 80 works just fine.
          It's incredibly cheaper (ie. 25% or less of the cost of cool-fit) and, despite what people say, it functions just fine below 32º. Never had a problem with it.
          If you are doing this to last "forever" with no intention of significant expansion or growth - and if you have 5,000 to 10,000+ laying around for cool fit - go for it... but I would put the money into a new glycol chiller, instead...

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          • #6
            PVC vote

            I hope I don't regret saying this but (knocking on wood) we have some glycol piping in the pub that were plumbed in schedule 40 PVC and have survived 22 years (knocking really hard on wood now). The only time we've experienced a major piping failure it was due to roofers slamming the pipes around on the roof, thinking they were copper refrigeration lines. I completely agree that if you have the cash, coolfit or similar is the way to go. However, the much lower cost of PVC, even schedule 80, still makes it a viable option for those on a budget. Just make sure that it is well supported so it doesn't get shaken around too much when the solenoids open and close. I would also recommend using a rigid, closed cell insulation instead of the popular Rubatex/Armaflex spongy black stuff which tends to get waterlogged and nasty in wet, high condensation prone areas like a brewhouse.
            Steve Bradt
            Regional Sales Manager
            Micro-Matic Packaging Division
            Eastern United States and Canada
            sbradt@micro-matic.com
            785-766-1921

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            • #7
              We have had sched 40 in our brewery for over a decade and only recently had two small leaks. Keep in mind we also get a lot of hammering on those pipes. As I have had to replace the 40 i have used 80. It may not be rated for it but it does work when your on a budget. If you have the chance to do it right the first time, do it. We use 40 for the header only and copper for the drops to the tanks. I installed a propagator with pex recently with good results, time will tell.
              Joel Halbleib
              Partner / Zymurgist
              Hive and Barrel Meadery
              6302 Old La Grange Rd
              Crestwood, KY
              www.hiveandbarrel.com

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              • #8
                Drops

                I've seen this at a number of breweries - where they actually hard piped Sched 40 or Sched 80 directly to the jacket of the FV. Use 3/4" hose barbs and 3/4" Good Year Pliovic to access the jacket from the manifold... allows you flexibility...

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by grassrootsvt
                  I've seen this at a number of breweries - where they actually hard piped Sched 40 or Sched 80 directly to the jacket of the FV. Use 3/4" hose barbs and 3/4" Good Year Pliovic to access the jacket from the manifold... allows you flexibility...
                  I like this idea because it allows for an easy way to disconnect the glycol lines if you want to drain your glycol and attach a warm water line, say from a hot water on demand system, if you want to raise the temp of your tanks if the brewhouse is colder or you want a prolonged high temp fermentation on say a saison.
                  Beejay
                  Pipeworks Brewing Company

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                  • #10
                    Hate to side with the less durable side...

                    but we've been using PVC for 10 years with no significant issues. This is the cream colored, schedule 40 product. The dark grey, schedule 80 is almost always CPVC. A bit more durable. Look, I'm all for hard piping in copper and insulating with foam and jacketing with a hard plastic shell, but is the expense for a small brewery really worth it? Not for me. I'd rather replace the whole brewery glycol lines once every 10 years. We do NOT insulate our PVC lines, but then again we are in a tropical environment and any loss of cool just keeps our aircon for the brewery working less often. I know there are many who will disagree, but we've got very little invested in our glycol distribution system, and it works just as well as the much more expensive solution. I'd also rather put my money in an energy efficient chiller.
                    Phillip Kelm--Palau Brewing Company Manager--

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                    • #11
                      Glycol pipework

                      I've just recently gone through a brewpub move. Originally I had copper pipes on the fermenters and never had a single leak. When we moved, we used PVC sch 40. Within 3 months they all started leaking ! I spoke to a chemist who advised against using PVC with Dowfrost which is what I'm using.
                      We switched over to Copper pipe and I can sleep now !

                      T
                      Tariq Khan (Brewer/Distiller)

                      Yaletown Brewing and Distilling Co.
                      Vancouver, B.C.
                      Canada

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                      • #12
                        I've often used old brewery hoses that seem a bit beyond using for wort but just fine for glycol. I like how they are eminently flexible, and can easily be switched around to warm a tank, or for moving tanks.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by tariq khan
                          I've just recently gone through a brewpub move. Originally I had copper pipes on the fermenters and never had a single leak. When we moved, we used PVC sch 40. Within 3 months they all started leaking ! I spoke to a chemist who advised against using PVC with Dowfrost which is what I'm using.
                          We switched over to Copper pipe and I can sleep now !

                          T

                          Did the leaks appear at the glued pvc joints, or did the pipe just crack, or did it leak at the pvc to metal unions?
                          Joel Halbleib
                          Partner / Zymurgist
                          Hive and Barrel Meadery
                          6302 Old La Grange Rd
                          Crestwood, KY
                          www.hiveandbarrel.com

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Glycol Pipework

                            Originally posted by BrewinLou
                            Did the leaks appear at the glued pvc joints, or did the pipe just crack, or did it leak at the pvc to metal unions?
                            Joel,

                            The leaks occurred at the glued Pvc joints, right where the pipe is going into the F.V. I initially suspected the glue as a culprit as well and it's quite possible that the glue doesn't like the Dowfrost also.

                            T
                            Tariq Khan (Brewer/Distiller)

                            Yaletown Brewing and Distilling Co.
                            Vancouver, B.C.
                            Canada

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Glycol Piping

                              Has anyone looked at Pex?? I am meeting with a company rep on Monday to discuss this. He seems pretty confident it will work with less costs than copper.
                              Have a Great Week,
                              Frank Kassik
                              Kassik's Brewery
                              Kenai, Alaska

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