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Brites/Serving Tanks vs. Kegs for tap room, Advice, Pros and Cons

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  • Brites/Serving Tanks vs. Kegs for tap room, Advice, Pros and Cons

    Just looking for folks experience in using either Serving tanks vs kegs to fulfill taproom demand(sales)
    I brief discussion on perhaps why you went with your decision, how it has worked out and what you might do differently given the chance.
    Pro and Con discussion or success vs nightmare discussion.
    Thanks for your input.
    Zoob

  • #2
    If you have 12 or more taps how big cooler you need to have for 12 serving tanks?

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    • #3
      I weigh that issue now.

      We have 11 taps with 8 main beers. I have a 9'x20' walk in cooler with a 36" glass door. I brew 2.5bbl of beer (5 kegs) but my one brite tank will fit 4 bbl plus some headspace. My brite is in the walk-in non-jacketed.

      If I could use serving tanks it would save a lot of my time weighing, filling, rinsing and weighing, storing, changing kegs, weighing empty, and finally cleaning to start all over.

      I have 75 kegs and can basically fill most of them and store them in the walk in. It's a lot of work moving them around and a pain to stop and change kegs when they pop.

      We currently blow 6-7 kegs per week. By having a stockpile it means I can not brew for a month-ish before we run dangerously close to running out of beer.

      I can't use tanks wider than 36" max. I'm looking into having narrower but taller tanks made to fit the 8 tanks plus a few extra sitting in reserve. I keg condition, so another advantage would be the ability to fill a keg off the serving tank from the "clean" beer for events or special events and not worrying about hazy beer.

      But to be honest, the 75 kegs used cost me about $3,000 compared to the potential $40,000 in serving tanks.

      I haven't timed how long it takes me to cycle through the kegs to figure out how long it would take to make it financially break even, but $40,000 for a nano is a huge chunk of change.

      Jc


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      JC McDowell
      Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
      Darby, MT- population 700
      OPENED Black Friday 2014!

      Comment


      • #4
        I am extremely interested in this as I am considering serving tanks right now. I know tanks will require a large walk in cooler, but in order to store 75 full kegs including the space to have access to 11 different kegs on tap your cooler needs to be pretty big.
        I am interested in 10bbl serving tanks that I could fill from our 20bbl brite. The rest would go into kegs for distribution.
        Any feedback would be great.


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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        • #5
          We're a 7 bbl brewpub, with 8 taps, and sell almost everything through them. I have four 7 bbl serving tanks in the walk-in and the rest are kegged. I spend a LOT of my time washing/filling/moving kegs just to service the taps. Plan all along was to get another Brite or two in there, and we sized the room accordingly. The only reason we didn't start out at full tank capacity was cost. Had to cut somewhere to get open. But I would be surprised if the math didn't work out that all the time filling/cleaning/sanitizing/moving kegs didn't ad up to another BT in a reasonable amount of time. It does in my case and I'm going to get a couple more.
          Dave Cowie
          Three Forks Bakery & Brewing Company
          Nevada City, CA

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          • #6
            The answer is...it depends. If you are a brewpub and plan on zero outside distribution, brites make the most sense. If you are a full production brewery with a small attached taproom, kegs usually make more sense. In between you'll need to find the balance of space, cost, and flexibility that works for you.

            Brites are nice because you don't need to wash as many kegs (though you'll still need some around). But (typically) you have to go spend some quality time cleaning them in the Cold Room, which can be a drag (and a mess if you don't have drains in there).

            Kegs offer flexibility. You can run them in series so you only need to tap new ones every few days, rather than in the middle of service. Seriously, killing a keg mid-growler-fill sucks. Also you can make more one-off kegs and pull weird things out of the cellar.

            But I think the best bet is a mix. You'll have one to three beers that are 50% of your sales and those will be the beers your regulars drink. Put those in brites. We typically kill a keg of our IPA every single day in the summer. (Which is why running in series is so good.). If I had room to put in a brite for IPA I would (and I've considered a variety of ways) but our cold room is only 12 x 20 and is too damn small. But Seasonals and so on that are 'new' usually have an easier time wholesale, are more interesting at beer festivals, and so on, so keg those.
            Russell Everett
            Co-Founder / Head Brewer
            Bainbridge Island Brewing
            Bainbridge Island, WA

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            • #7
              [QUOTE=Crosley;144978]I am extremely interested in this as I am considering serving tanks right now. I know tanks will require a large walk in cooler, but in order to store 75 full kegs including the space to have access to 11 different kegs on tap your cooler needs to be pretty big.
              I am interested in 10bbl serving tanks that I could fill from our 20bbl brite. The rest would go into kegs for distribution.
              Any feedback would be great.

              Jacketed servers don't require a cooler, but require a chiller. You can also serve each beer at the proper temp. I would like someone, Bainbridge perhaps, to chime in on the loss per keg. You can't get every pint out.

              Comment


              • #8
                I'm looking at 3 bbl serving tanks with a 22" diameter footprint- which makes it feasible to put in 12 brutes. 8 on tap and 4 conditioning. No man ways but CIP ready.


                Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                JC McDowell
                Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                Darby, MT- population 700
                OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                Comment


                • #9
                  We measure our kegs empty, full, and empty again- the answer on keg loss is- "it depends".

                  We don't filter but have a 3 day diactyl rest/dry hop period and another 3 cold crash rest before we transfer with biofine powder at 80ml per 80ish gallons.

                  If my production goes according to schedule and the fermentation goes normally- we average 1% loss per keg for a total of 5% per batch chocked up to production losses.

                  If I rush things and don't let the beers settle before cold crash- we have a lot more waste per keg.


                  Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                  JC McDowell
                  Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                  Darby, MT- population 700
                  OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi JC. You completely lost me, which is not hard to do. I'm not sure what diactyl rests and cold crashing have to do with my question which I'm now thinking I worded improperly. Bainbridge (Russel) hooks his kegs in series which I used to do at my brewpub. I was trying to ask (because I can't remember) how many pints remain in the "empty" keg after its, well... empty. because it's never truly empty. Must be 2 or 3 pints that can't get pumped out. I figure the wasted beer must be accounted for along with the time spent filling and cleaning kegs when comparing against serving tanks. If you get $5 a pint and you sell 7 kegs a week and there's 3 pints per keg you can't serve, you're missing out on $105 a week which could go to paying for your $40k servers.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I like the "running in series" idea but...

                      It takes up a lot of floor space. I've seen the keg spacers where you could tap a keg and put a second keg on tap with the spacer- maybe that would work?

                      Obviously multiple sanke connectors and hoses for each keg in series. If I wanted to put all 8 of my regular beers in series with say 3 kegs- that's 24 sanke couplers at roughly $30 a pop- $720 in couplers. Still cheaper than one serving tank.

                      Kegs are dedicated until entire series is tapped out. You can't take a keg out of series until they are all empty. Maybe with cycling not an issue. Not all you beers are going to run out at the same time. I think you could put a new keg in front and move the couplers but you'll always need a keg for each coupler.

                      Not so good for keg conditioned beers. When you reach the end of one keg it pulls up all the gunk and dumps it on top of the next keg- more kegs in line- more gunk. How much haze would be transferred?

                      The obvious- a whole lot more hoses and potential for leaks. Somehow my taproom people have tied knots in my lines as it is- multiply that by 2 or 3.




                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                      JC McDowell
                      Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                      Darby, MT- population 700
                      OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Beer bred-

                        We don't mechanically filter. If I rush the beer through diactyl rests and cold crash we still have yeast in suspension which eventually settles to the bottom of the keg and we end up getting less drinkable beer in a keg once the yeast settles un disturbed and is not pumped out with the first or second pint when tapped.

                        Otherwise, our settled yeast is below the 1% mark when the keg pops (with clear beer to that point). We are seeing about 20 ish ounces remaining.


                        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                        JC McDowell
                        Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                        Darby, MT- population 700
                        OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yeah- by Beerbred's logic for my scale I could basically buy a serving tank each year based on the 2 beers saved per keg.

                          I'm kinda feeling better about this already[emoji3]


                          Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                          JC McDowell
                          Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                          Darby, MT- population 700
                          OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Ok- you convinced me. I'm going to order one to test it out.


                            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                            JC McDowell
                            Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                            Darby, MT- population 700
                            OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Ugh- because of my walk in door size (glass 36") and small walk in size, I have contracted a custom made 22" diameter tank from a company in Sand Pointe, Idaho- SWHFT (solar tanks). I ordered it without man way, no valves, simplified ports for exactly what we need and it wasn't really any cheaper than a 3 bbl serving tank but it fit my needs better and I didn't have to wait 3 months. I ordered it with sanitary welds and tri clover fittings.

                              I got it and it's nowhere near the quality necessary to hold beer. The seams look pretty on the outside but have gaps and crevices in the inside. There was still metal splinters in the inside of the ports which protruded the tank without full penetration welds.

                              So no Bueno.

                              I'm having my local pharmaceutical grade welder cut it open and fix it from the inside.

                              The other concern is the height and keeping the beer properly carbonated. I need to work with a company to work out the details before we get 11 more tanks.


                              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
                              JC McDowell
                              Bandit Brewing Co.- 3bbl brewery and growing
                              Darby, MT- population 700
                              OPENED Black Friday 2014!

                              Comment

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