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Cask vs Wild Goose vs Palmer vs ABE

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  • Cask vs Wild Goose vs Palmer vs ABE

    Evaluating these canning lines, and wondering if those using any of these have any feedback; good/bad/ugly.

  • #2
    Cask ACS 5 head machine

    Notes:
    The Core control system of this machine is pretty solid.
    This unit will be way more stable if you don't attempt to push the CPM number too high.
    The main instability is the seamer and the air cylinders that move cans on and off the table, unless they have changed this area.
    Everything has to be in trim in this area of the machine or it wil crush cans big time. The setup and maintenance of this subsystem is critical and temperamental but can be mastered.

    The rinse tunnel we received was not set up correctly and was a major issue at and well beyond startup.
    The shaker table is also problematic.
    My strong advice on these 2 fronts is to check out " Ska Fabrication " as they have solved these 2 issues with a system that works far better.

    You need to strongly consider getting an optical metrology system to analyze your finished can seams right from the start. There are several on the market that work much the same way. The thing that no one is told about is the maintenance interval for the critical bearing replacement on the seamer assembly. Because no one mentions this most new to canning have to learn the hard way.
    If you follow an optical trend from the start, the extra expense will be worth its weight in gold, plus you will see how your machine setup was right out of the gate which will enhance your capability in dealing with double seam issues down the road. The optical rigs are not cheap but are a must in my experience.

    You need a fair amount of Electro-Mechancal savvy to maintain this machine.
    You will be changing all bearings on the seamer, spindle, and table at regular intervals.
    There are some sharp guys in Engineering at Cask. It would really be something if they would take some feedback from the field and offer some retrofit design upgrades that address stability and speed in relation to can feed and seaming operations rather than focus solely on selling new machines.

    The best possible thing to do is to go to as many operations as possible and see the machines in action, talk to the operators, and the mechanics. The more time you spend doing this, the better you will feel about your final decision. AS with all machines each will have its unique quirks that are often particular and peculiar to your operation. A very comprehensive spare parts stock is a must.
    Last edited by Starcat; 09-27-2015, 12:04 PM.
    Warren Turner
    Industrial Engineering Technician
    HVACR-Electrical Systems Specialist
    Moab Brewery
    The Thought Police are Attempting to Suppress Free Speech and Sugar coat everything. This is both Cowardice and Treason given to their own kind.

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    • #3
      Currently getting 56-64 CPM out of an old cask 5 head system, but thats with cider so not a direct correlation to beer. But EVERYTHING the above poster said is spot on about these machines. It can be great and reliable, or it can make you tear your hair out. If your savvy it'll mostly be the first, if not almost entirely the second. the seaming area is definitely the part that requires the most attention. check seams often no matter what you get. They can be done by hand but its a chore.

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      • #4
        Palmer canning line

        We have a 12/1 Palmer rotary line that has been in use for almost a year and a half and it runs great! Costs more than in line systems for sure but worth the added cost. We have packaged beer from 2.7 volumes up to 3.04 volumes and from temps as low as 28 degrees up to 41 degrees with no problems. Run around 38-45 16 oz cans per minute.

        Cheers,

        Don

        Originally posted by ABM Equipment
        I now work with a Brew house equipment manufacture however I built and initially managed a 15bbl start up brewery that had an ABE, or Norland international canning line. Norland international has been in the bottling and process line business pretty much since the beginning of bottled water. I have a large mechanical back ground and I found the Norland system to be very consistent and easy to use. The other advantage is the 15 can per min unit and be upgraded to a 30 or 60 can per min with just a few more components and some programing, so very little down time if planned right. The fill rate is a little slower than some other systems however foaming is very manageable, even with a 3.0 + carb. I would recommend getting the full de-palletizer though, half can pallets are just a pain and not that cost effective. Also we never had more than 2 guys running the line so labor savings were great. The daily production of 12oz 6 packs was about 100-150 cases with a lin-can-15


        I now work with ABM Equipment out of Vancouver, WA. We have been a leader in malt handling for many year, however we now offer full American brew systems and brewery build-out consulting. We have the unique ability to offer our clients with a true full service package- Design to Manufacturing to Install. If you need some help with expansion planning or equipment please send me an email.


        Eric McCormick
        emccormick@abmequipment.com

        www.abmequipment.com

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