Defoamer for kettle/fermenters

[TGTimm]

We've never used defoamers in our process. We have problems with (rare) boil-ever in the kettle, and excessive loss--and mess--from foam during high krausen in our head space-limited fermenters.

We make unfiltered ales and lagers, so silicones seems to be out. I've read (somewhere, but where?) that canola-oil-based defoamers (anit-foamers?) are used as a nutrient during fermentation and can actually improve head retention and hops perception.

I'm looking for any documentation or hands-on experience to convince myself, my boss, and our brewers that we can safely go this route and maybe improve brewhouse safety and cut some fermentation losses--without compromising our product's quality.

TIA--

[dick murton]

I've been told that silicon based antifoams, providing added in kettle or right at start of fermentation do not leave any residue to kill the head in unfiltered beers. It is all absorbed by the yeast and sedimented proteins.

However, I have no personal experience of using them for anything other than filtered beers, so cannot give my personal assurance that the statement is 100 % true of unfiltered beer in final package. What I do know is that any spillages pre filter (after conditioning and yeast / bottoms removal) still make a lot of apparently stable foam - but as I say, not having lab tested the head retention to compare.....

[TGTimm]

Thanks, Dick.

FDA says active silicones may be used in the production of beers if the beers are filtered or centrifuged. We do neither, and have no plans to do so.

I'm aware this has been discussed here before, but I can find no posts since 2005, and the links in those posts are all broken.

I'm querying several chemical distributors about this, but nothing beats first-hand experience!

[wailingguitar]

I have been using BIRKO's Patcote376 (canola based) anti foam and absolutely love the stuff. I use 2oz in kettle (10bbl) on all my brews and have zero issue with boil over since. I also use 2oz/10bbl in the whirlpool to prevent foam out during blow off on my dark beers like porter and imperial stout. It works like a champ and I have seen no adverse effect in the finished product.

[dick murton]

Interesting. I'll have to see if anything similar is available over here.

I assume it is not a stupidly / dangerously slippy if spilled as silicon based stuff either - a good safety point

[TGTimm]

Thanks, Wailin'

So, you add to the kettle and the whirlpool both?

Does it have any effect on the fermentation foaming if added to kettle only?

[wailingguitar]

Thanks, Wailin'

So, you add to the kettle and the whirlpool both?

Does it have any effect on the fermentation foaming if added to kettle only?

For antifoam for boil I add it about the time the kettle comes to full and it prevents boil over. For fermentation anti foam I add it during the whirlpool (5 to 10 minute whirlpool/10 to 15 minute rest) or immediately before knockout.

[TGTimm]

I just spoke to Dana J @ Birko. We're getting a gallon to try out.

Just out of curiosity, anyone use the 5-Star 880? Is this the same or similar? Cost comparison?

[wailingguitar]

I just spoke to Dana J @ Birko. We're getting a gallon to try out.

Just out of curiosity, anyone use the 5-Star 880? Is this the same or similar? Cost comparison?

Don't know about that 5-Star product specifically. Dana is the man, he won't steer you wrong.

[BrewingmanDan]

Defoamer

We use it at our brewery, in the copper and FV and we do not filter and have no problems at all. For use in the FV you need just a small amount diluted with water this usually does the trick.

[tonbrew]

I've tried the 5 star 880, wasn't a fan, and went back to patcote 376. The 5 star works wonders in a blow off bucket, but didn't help with keeping krausen in the FV.

Sent from my SM-G920T using Tapatalk

[TGTimm]

Thanks, all!

We'll be trying the whirlpool addition on our next batch--2 oz/10bbl?

[wailingguitar]

Thanks, all!

We'll be trying the whirlpool addition on our next batch--2 oz/10bbl?

Yes, that is what I have been using with good results