Canning systems from FRUSSO - does anyone know these systems ?

[danibier]

Hi brewers,

I have been looking around for a suitable canning system for quite a while. Lately I found this producer here:

http://frusso.com/subsitios/productos/catalogo.php

The systems look really nice on youtube I must say. It seems they even counterpressure-fill the cans.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sV-kMAGCaM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c5KP_rqib6M

I know most canning guys are talking about cask, wildgoose and ABE.

Does anyone know these canning systems from FRUSSO? If yes, good or bad experiences?

Best regards, Daniel

https://www.danibier.ch

[Jim ComtoniKa]

Hi Daniel, i am from Argentine and also looking for a canning system, to be honest im not even considering them, havent seen their equipment recently so i may go to the factory again and watch if they improved, but the brewmaster went to their company a couple of years ago to see a bottling line and it was really bad, sloppy, trouble maker equipment. If you got or get any reference from someone that actually bought a canning line from them please let me know.
Javier.

[Jim ComtoniKa]

Nose, mandé un mensaje a al empresa hace un rato pidiendo cotización.

[danibier]

Language: My mothertounge is Swiss German, 2. Language German, 3. Language French, 4. Language English - Sorry, there is no space for Spanish anymore. ;-) I will use google translate to read yours, use google translate to read mine. No problemo.

Ok, I see. Not so nice to read. Youtube videos often look better than reality - I guess it is the same with Tinder and dating sites. ;-)
However, I sent them an email. The lady who replied says she is on holidays and she will send me the prices and more information. But the machines look quite nice I must say.


This video here is quite inspring: https://www.facebook.com/dasradler/v...type=2&theater
They are just drafting into the can and use a can seamer like the manual systems from Cask and WildGoose. It seems like they blow also CO2 in there before filling (thin pipes).


This is another option I am thinking of:

Can filler: In Europe computer dispensers are quite popular (no manual drafting). You just push a button and the exact amount of beer goes into the glass and they even have a foam button. All is programmable like I push one button "beer comes out - stop - foam comes out - stop". Something like this: http://grapos.com/schanktechnik/comp...-das-original/ The costs for 2-4 computer dispenser taps is maybe 3000 - 4000 USD.

Can seamer: Can seamer from China: http://www.penglaichina.com/PET-pape...g-machine.html - they are 2000 - 3000 USD and look quite good.

Such a system would be much less expensive than the manual systems from Cask or WildGoose - and probably not worse.... or even better.

Another question is the oxygen pick up. I would love to see a paper that shows the oxygen pickup with and without CO2-purging the can before. There will be foam anyhow when the can will be closed. So, how much oxygen is really picked up during the filling? And how bad is it really - especially when you take into account the fact that I would fill unfiltered beer into the can. The yeast would probably eat most of the oxygen.
I could also imagine that the CO2-puriging has not such a big effect. Why? When you start filling the beer CO2 comes out immediately creating a CO2 film immediately on the beer protecting it a bit during the fill cycle.

Does anyone know more about the oxygenpickup topic?

Best regards, Daniel

https://www.danibier.ch

[Jim ComtoniKa]

Language: My mothertounge is Swiss German, 2. Language German, 3. Language French, 4. Language English - Sorry, there is no space for Spanish anymore. ;-) I will use google translate to read yours, use google translate to read mine. No problemo.

Ok, I see. Not so nice to read. Youtube videos often look better than reality - I guess it is the same with Tinder and dating sites. ;-)
However, I sent them an email. The lady who replied says she is on holidays and she will send me the prices and more information. But the machines look quite nice I must say.


This video here is quite inspring: https://www.facebook.com/dasradler/v...type=2&theater
They are just drafting into the can and use a can seamer like the manual systems from Cask and WildGoose. It seems like they blow also CO2 in there before filling (thin pipes).


This is another option I am thinking of:

Can filler: In Europe computer dispensers are quite popular (no manual drafting). You just push a button and the exact amount of beer goes into the glass and they even have a foam button. All is programmable like I push one button "beer comes out - stop - foam comes out - stop". Something like this: http://grapos.com/schanktechnik/comp...-das-original/ The costs for 2-4 computer dispenser taps is maybe 3000 - 4000 USD.

Can seamer: Can seamer from China: http://www.penglaichina.com/PET-pape...g-machine.html - they are 2000 - 3000 USD and look quite good.

Such a system would be much less expensive than the manual systems from Cask or WildGoose - and probably not worse.... or even better.

Another question is the oxygen pick up. I would love to see a paper that shows the oxygen pickup with and without CO2-purging the can before. There will be foam anyhow when the can will be closed. So, how much oxygen is really picked up during the filling? And how bad is it really - especially when you take into account the fact that I would fill unfiltered beer into the can. The yeast would probably eat most of the oxygen.
I could also imagine that the CO2-puriging has not such a big effect. Why? When you start filling the beer CO2 comes out immediately creating a CO2 film immediately on the beer protecting it a bit during the fill cycle.

Does anyone know more about the oxygenpickup topic?

Best regards, Daniel

https://www.danibier.ch

Sorry Daniel i gave for granted you spoke spanish. I asked them for a pricing on the machine too just to compare.

You certainly can go for a manual filler/seamer sytem, its cheaper, but its more labor intensive and it doesnt produce the same amount of cans. The same companys that make the automatic ones also have manual systems (abe/wg/cask). Filling them like that german brewery seems doable too, but if you want some serious amount of can IMO that wont be very satisfactory long term. Automated machines can make about 8000 cans a day, while with the manual system (and specially with a single draft) im guessing you can get maybe 400-500.

Regarding the can seamer i would not buy that chinese one at all, it doesnt look nit, and the company that make it has very bad references (you can check on the equipment section). But there are much better options for individual seamers, will cost more, but will function properly. Seamers are very delicated equipments.

I dont have information about o2 contents sorry.

Javier

[danibier]

I received the prices. It looks like they are similar like Cask, WildGoose, ABE.



Best regards, Daniel

https://www.danibier.ch

[danibier]

I just found this US-company here: http://www.inlineautomation.co/ The systems look very nice. I especially like the seamer.

Videos here: https://www.facebook.com/sociablecider/videos

[Starcat]

Inline System

I just found this US-company here: http://www.inlineautomation.co/ The systems look very nice. I especially like the seamer.

Videos here: https://www.facebook.com/sociablecider/videos

I took note of this system within the last 2 years. It was then seemingly very new but as you have stated with some positive looking attributes. When I spoke to that outfit then they could not provide me with clear answers to questions then such as can the line do 100 CPM?
This seems to have been because the system was so new and not really out into usage then. The rotary fill unit and lack of push air cylinders would be quite desirable.

[danibier]

They responded quickly. Here the prices:

Inline Automation Can Line Pricing 2015
ILA-DP-1 Inline Depalletizer $29,500.00
TRS-100 Twist Rinse Sanitizer 12oz. $5,000.00
TRS-101 Twist Rinse Sanitizer 16oz. $5,000.00
ILA-RCPF-1 Rotary Counter Pressure Filler $37,500.00
ILA-CS-1 Can Seamer $37,500.00
Can Labeling Options
Option 1 Smyth Labeler $29,000.00
(Purchased through Smyth)
Option 2 IN_LINE 700SP Labeler $20,785.00
(Not a part of Inline Automation)
Conveyor Quote to fit

The prices seem more or less ok compared with other producers.

Best regards, Daniel

https://www.danibier.ch

[Starcat]

They responded quickly. Here the prices:

Inline Automation Can Line Pricing 2015
ILA-DP-1 Inline Depalletizer $29,500.00
TRS-100 Twist Rinse Sanitizer 12oz. $5,000.00
TRS-101 Twist Rinse Sanitizer 16oz. $5,000.00
ILA-RCPF-1 Rotary Counter Pressure Filler $37,500.00
ILA-CS-1 Can Seamer $37,500.00
Can Labeling Options
Option 1 Smyth Labeler $29,000.00
(Purchased through Smyth)
Option 2 IN_LINE 700SP Labeler $20,785.00
(Not a part of Inline Automation)
Conveyor Quote to fit

The prices seem more or less ok compared with other producers.

Best regards, Daniel
www.danibier.ch

Daniel, excellent.
I would be interested in seeing one of those lines in action before I made a decision, but the Rotary Tech is generally far superior to the fillers used on Cask, ABE, and Wild Goose Lines to my knowledge. Also the lack of high maintenance, high failure air cylinders that are constantly exposed to beer is a major factor to consider.

[beerme]

ask if the wiring is csa/ ul approved.

i know of people who bought foreign equipment and were forced to rewire the whole thing.

you get what you pay for...

[danibier]

Some days ago I found this US-company here: http://twinmonkeys.net/yampa-beer-canning-machine/

Their canning systems look quite clever I must say. The Yampa is around 40 k$ as they wrote me. Compared to others quite a fair price.

I got my Chinese can seamer from penglaichina.com and I am quite happy so far. I fill the cans at the moment with an automatic beer dispenser for restaurants with 4 heads which I bought second hand. A very cheap solution, but still quite fast: http://danielmichel77.wix.com/index#!danican/hr2u4

Videos here:

https://www.facebook.com/176739955731354/videos/1114217771983563/

https://www.facebook.com/176739955731354/videos/1117845888287418/

https://www.facebook.com/176739955731354/videos/1129281633810510/

https://www.facebook.com/176739955731354/videos/1117647644973909/

Best regards, Daniel

https://www.danibier.ch

https://www.danisbrewtower.com