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Thread: Is temperature vital when kegging from bright tank

  1. #1
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    Is temperature vital when kegging from bright tank

    Just finished carbing our second beer last night and was planning on kegging it later today. Overnight however the temp rose to 42~43F (long story). Is it ok to keg at that higher temp or should I wait until it gets back down to carbing temps?

  2. #2
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    You can fill kegs at any temp you want, you just have to put a ton more pressure in the tank to keep the co2 in solution. You're better off cooling it back down and waiting though.

  3. #3
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    Ach - I just tried a sample and on top of being warm it's over-carbed now (drew a glass from the sample valve and got 95% foam!)
    I released a bunch of the head pressure (down to about 11.5 PSI) and am going to let it chill back down over night (I'm guessing it will be down around 36F by tomorrow). i'm shooting for ~2.7 volumes so hopefully that will put me in the ballpark or maybe a little under so I can bring it back up to the right pressure.

    Please weigh in if there are any glaring flaws in my plan!

  4. #4
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    Pigtail?

    Do you have a pigtail on your sample valve? Without one, you will always get a glass of foam, regardless of whether it's over carbed.

  5. #5
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    I do not and I will give that a shot but I can definitely say that it wasn't nearly as foamy earlier in the day yesterday.

    So basically just a length of tubing to reach to the bottom of the glass?

  6. #6
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    If you don't have a way to accurately check the carbonation in your beer, I see a glaring flaw in your plan. Even with a pigtail, in my opinion, you can't really judge the carbonation levels and you would be risking sending out over-or-undercarbed beer, and that will lose you taps really fast. If it is for in-house use, you still will have problems with over-carbed beer and pouring foam down the drain.


    Quote Originally Posted by somenerve View Post
    Ach - I just tried a sample and on top of being warm it's over-carbed now (drew a glass from the sample valve and got 95% foam!)
    I released a bunch of the head pressure (down to about 11.5 PSI) and am going to let it chill back down over night (I'm guessing it will be down around 36F by tomorrow). i'm shooting for ~2.7 volumes so hopefully that will put me in the ballpark or maybe a little under so I can bring it back up to the right pressure.

    Please weigh in if there are any glaring flaws in my plan!
    Linus Hall
    Yazoo Brewing
    Nashville, TN
    [url]www.yazoobrew.com[/url]

  7. #7
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    zahm and nagel chart

    check this handy chart out:
    http://www.zahmnagel.com/charts/

    it tells you carbonation in Vols for varying temperature/ pressures. For example if you want 2.70Vol at 36 F you will need an equilibrium pressure of 12.5 PSIG. If your present temperature is higher, consult the chart to see the higher pressure you will need.

    Note, this is equilibrium pressure, meaning the pressure of the gas dissolved in the beer, not just the pressure on the headspace. Just because you crank the top pressure up doesn't mean it is actually dissolved in the liquid.

    There are many threads here explaining carbonation, so pour yourself a warm flat beer and read up while you wait for your tank to cool down...


    So, to answer the first question, you could keg warm beer possibly, but you need a much higher pressure to keep the carbonation in.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by beerme View Post
    check this handy chart out:
    http://www.zahmnagel.com/charts/

    it tells you carbonation in Vols for varying temperature/ pressures. For example if you want 2.70Vol at 36 F you will need an equilibrium pressure of 12.5 PSIG. If your present temperature is higher, consult the chart to see the higher pressure you will need.

    Note, this is equilibrium pressure, meaning the pressure of the gas dissolved in the beer, not just the pressure on the headspace. Just because you crank the top pressure up doesn't mean it is actually dissolved in the liquid.

    There are many threads here explaining carbonation, so pour yourself a warm flat beer and read up while you wait for your tank to cool down...


    So, to answer the first question, you could keg warm beer possibly, but you need a much higher pressure to keep the carbonation in.

    Ha! I literally LOL'd at "pour yourself a warm flat beer" :-)

    Yup - I'm using the volume charts that are available all over the interwebs - and I'm primarily using this document as a primer:

    https://chme.nmsu.edu/files/2016/06/...arbonation.pdf

    In a nutshell I found my target pressure from the charts, add head pressure to about 1 PSI below the target, move the co2 hose to the stone and set it at the target pressure and wait for the head pressure to tick up to the target which (hopefully) indicates equilibrium. Sound right?

    And yeah, I'd love to be able to test it with a Zahm to make absolute sure but $1300 just isn't in our budget right now. I'm hoping to pick up one of those carb-testers from Taprite soon - just need to get some cash-flow happening (we're *really* close to opening the doors...) I've found some threads on that contraption and it sounds like, while not perfect, it will suffice for giving us a good ballpark volumes reading.

    Incidentally if anyone can link me to some good threads on bright tank carbonating I'd really appreciate it. I find ProBrewer's search engine really cumbersome.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by somenerve View Post
    Incidentally if anyone can link me to some good threads on bright tank carbonating I'd really appreciate it. I find ProBrewer's search engine really cumbersome.

    https://discussions.probrewer.com/sh...bonating+10BBL

    Pay particular attention to gitchegumee's posts. Been using his technique from day one and it works flawlessly every time.

    Cheers,
    --
    Don

  10. #10
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    Thanks Don! I've actually was just reading some of his and the more the merrier!

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by somenerve View Post
    I do not and I will give that a shot but I can definitely say that it wasn't nearly as foamy earlier in the day yesterday.

    So basically just a length of tubing to reach to the bottom of the glass?

    If you don't have an actual carbonation tester (ie. Zahm), you can also use a counter-pressure bottling gun. Note - a Blichman beer gun is not a counter-pressure filler.

    For best results. Cold beer (as cold as you can get it). I keep my brite at -1 to 0C. Get your carbonation pressure and carb stone technique dialed in. Test the carbonation level with at minimum a counter-pressure fill to a bottle but best with a testing device like the Zahm or, if you have to dough, Aanton Parr. Don't bother with the Taprite. Save money and get a counter-pressure hand filler.
    Last edited by mswebb; 06-06-2018 at 07:45 AM.

  12. #12
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    This: https://www.ssbrewtech.com/products/...yABEgK_P_D_BwE is what we call a pigtail--properly a sampling coil. We use one that is just the coil with a short piece of tubing to connect to the sampling valve. The pigtail provides restriction, allowing you to pull a non-foamy sample.

    If you were carbed to around 2.7v/v at 30F, then let the temp rise to 43, your beer will foam like mad as the CO2 bursts out of solution.
    Timm Turrentine

    Brewerywright,
    Terminal Gravity Brewing,
    Enterprise. Oregon.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by idylldon View Post
    https://discussions.probrewer.com/sh...bonating+10BBL

    Pay particular attention to gitchegumee's posts. Been using his technique from day one and it works flawlessly every time.

    Cheers,
    --
    Don
    I'll second this. Since I switched to this technique I have not had any problems with under/over carbonation. It really does work well.
    Dave Cowie
    Three Forks Bakery & Brewing Company
    Nevada City, CA

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by barleyfreak View Post
    I'll second this. Since I switched to this technique I have not had any problems with under/over carbonation. It really does work well.
    One thing I’m not clear on with this method - what pressure should I set the the regulator that goes through the rotometer into the stone?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by somenerve View Post
    One thing I’m not clear on with this method - what pressure should I set the the regulator that goes through the rotometer into the stone?
    You are really going to have to figure that one out on your own. I bet everyone on here has a different psi based on different conditions.

    My regulator is set to 16.25 psi. I turn it on and leave it be overnight and in the morning the beer is ready.

    Use the process from Gitchegummee and modify it from there to suit your conditions.

    Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

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