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  • Reputation of Two Equipment Manufacturers

    Currently, I'm in the process of comparing quotes from a number of well-regarded (per Probrewer) equipment manufacturers for a 7 to 10 BBL indirect fire system with support equipment. Some of the companies have been more flexible and responsive than others, but I've narrowed it down to two. First is PKW and the second is Cedarstone Industry, in no particular order. Their quotes are within about 10-12% of each other, so I'm trying find a way to narrow things down for a decision.

    I've been searching for reviews and impressions from ProBrewer Forum members, but so far I haven't found anything definitive one way or the other. Can anyone here speak from personal or secondary experience how it is to work with these manufacturers, the quality of their product, and the warranty support after the purchase? On a related note, I've also been researching whether to spring for a mash rake/plough combo. It looks like conventional wisdom is indicating that it may not be worthwhile on a system of this size. Does the effectiveness of the mash hydrator mitigate the need to beat the stuffing out of the mash?

  • #2
    Portland Kettleworks

    Hey!

    We have been running on a 7BBL from Portland Kettleworks for 4 years now. We are super happy with the brewhouse and tanks. They are great to work with, very helpful, know their stuff and in general are great people. Feel free to shoot me a message or e-mail
    Marius Graff,
    Head Brewer, Graff Brygghus
    Tromsø, Norway

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    • #3
      Originally posted by MariusGraff View Post
      Hey!

      We have been running on a 7BBL from Portland Kettleworks for 4 years now. We are super happy with the brewhouse and tanks. They are great to work with, very helpful, know their stuff and in general are great people. Feel free to shoot me a message or e-mail
      Thank you, I think I'll take you up on that!

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      • #4
        All my brewery equipment is from PKW and we've been brewing on it for three years. I have a 5BBL steam-heated brewhouse, 10BBL HLT, two 5BBL fermenters, two 10BBL fermenters, four 10BBL brites, three 5BBL brites, and a malt mill from them. My glycol chiller (G&D) and HX were also supplied through PKW. All in all, the equipment has performed flawlessly and their service and support have been stellar. I would not hesitate to buy from PKW again, and most likely will when it's time for a new tank or two! As Marius said, if you have any questions just send me a PM and I'll give you my phone number and email address.

        Cheers,
        --
        Don
        Idyllwild Brewpub

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        • #5
          tanks

          Hi

          We build brewery equipment all made in North America up here in BC Canada

          we would like to quote your system please give me a call or send me an email


          wayne@ripleystainless.com
          1-250-494-9310 ext 103

          thanks

          Comment


          • #6
            I recently pitched in some help for a brewery with a PKW. The brew house and tanks were well made, but the pipe layout and design could use some major improvements. This may be a one-off problem, but the manway closures were absolutely atrocious. The galling is some of the worst I had ever seen, but the components were easily replaced. Now I have some more cool paper weights in the office.

            Also, ask your manufacturer to clean the tanks before shipment. The PKW tanks had a gnarly black and silver metallic dust from grinding and polishing. This crap had an electrostatic charge that made it impossible to remove with the traditional brewery CIP chemicals, as even nitric acid won't consume it. All of this could have been avoided in manufacturing with a little more care by the manufacturer.

            For those of you that may see this problem passivating new equipment: In the end it took a lot of physical wiping inside the tanks where possible and a fluorinated acid where physically wiping was not an option. Charged quats have worked in the past, but didn't here. Fluorinated acids are nasty chemicals that I would not recommend for the typical brewer. Get your chemical vendor or someone familiar with handling it to perform the CIPs. It will also change the finish of your tanks.
            Last edited by campbell.brian; 10-11-2019, 09:06 PM.
            -BC

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by campbell.brian View Post
              I recently pitched in some help for a brewery with a PKW. The brew house and tanks were well made, but the pipe layout and design could use some major improvements. This may be a one-off problem, but the manway closures were absolutely atrocious. The galling is some of the worst I had ever seen, but the components were easily replaced. Now I have some more cool paper weights in the office.

              Also, ask your manufacturer to clean the tanks before shipment. The PKW tanks had a gnarly black and silver metallic dust from grinding and polishing. This crap had an electrostatic charge that made it impossible to remove with the traditional brewery CIP chemicals, as even nitric acid won't consume it. All of this could have been avoided in manufacturing with a little more care by the manufacturer.

              For those of you that may see this problem passivating new equipment: In the end it took a lot of physical wiping inside the tanks where possible and a fluorinated acid where physically wiping was not an option. Charged quats have worked in the past, but didn't here. Fluorinated acids are nasty chemicals that I would not recommend for the typical brewer. Get your chemical vendor or someone familiar with handling it to perform the CIPs. It will also change the finish of your tanks.
              Brian, thank you for the insightful response. I was going to insist, whoever I go through, ensure the vessels are passivated before shipment, but I probably would've overlooked asking for interior cleaning regardless. That said, and I know this is a loaded question, a virtual apples-to-apples comparison of turnkey brewhouses from both PKW and Cedarstone are running about $34k difference in Cedarstone's favor.

              It could be as simple as the fact that they're in Texas and do finishing and fitment of foreign-sourced tanks, but the support components and electronics are US made. They were open with me about where their tanks are coming from, when I inquired, and assured me it is their plant that they have control of, not outsourced, producing the tanks and are using metal approved with samples for verification. My question is, is there $34k of benefit between the two if you simply had to make an educated guess? Another poster here PM'd me and said he visited their site in Houston and told me the welds were good and and appeared to be well-made overall. That extra money would be awfully handy for operating capital until everything is running on all cylinders.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by campbell.brian View Post
                Fluorinated acids are nasty chemicals that I would not recommend for the typical brewer. Get your chemical vendor or someone familiar with handling it to perform the CIPs. It will also change the finish of your tanks.
                DONT use this stuff. Seriously. Id say don't use it unless you know what you are doing, but most of you who may think you do - don't. Really!

                Less dangerous is toilet bowl cleaner. (contains muriatic acid and other cleaning agents) Specifically the blue extra-strength Lysol. Wipe on straight and rinse off. You will never again like this smell... Cheers to the folks at QTS equipment in WI for this tip, it works great. Still use your PPE.
                Brewmaster, Minocqua Brewing Company
                tbriggs@minocquabrewingcompany.com
                "Your results may vary"

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