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Thread: Enough bhp?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3

    Enough bhp?

    I'm just currently in the process of ordering our brewhouse and was really hoping to go with steam.
    I've received a few quotes for a new boiler but also discovered a one year old 6bhp boiler located at a university that's underpowered for their needs. I'm able to get a good price for it, however from my understanding I need a 7bhp unit for our 7bbl brewhouse. I guess the question is, will a 6bhp unit be enough to handle it? I'm lead to believe it'll work but is it realistic? Is it going to come to a boil in a reasonable time and handle a 14bbl HLT?

    Thanks for your help guys

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    370
    Is that a low pressure boiler? If no then it is show stopper.

    Your brewhouse manufacturer should give you steam requirements needed.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Palau
    Posts
    2,059

    I'd go for it.

    The boiler may be marginally adequate, but you need to know what pressure the steam is delivered and then the jacket size of the kettle. Can't easily put a low pressure boiler on a jacket made for high pressure. And although heat transfer-wise you may get away with the converse situation, it is dangerous. Get a professional on board to inspect both the boiler and the vessels. You'll need a sound technician to specify your steam train anyway. Sounds like it may work. Likely will not simultaneously heat kettle and HLT, but with proper planning why would you?
    Phillip Kelm--Palau Brewing Company Manager--

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3
    Thanks for the help.

    Our equipment is still on the drawing board at the manufacturer. It was being designed for low pressure. However after checking through my quotes again, it seems the supplier who sourced the used system for me overlooked that it's high pressure. Due to the building being of a small footprint and more importantly, nationally historic, I don't want the headaches of creating a boiler room. Perhaps I'm better off by buying a new system anyway. Again, I appreciate the help!

    Cheers

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Location
    Nashville
    Posts
    875
    Quote Originally Posted by Peam View Post
    Thanks for the help.

    Our equipment is still on the drawing board at the manufacturer. It was being designed for low pressure. However after checking through my quotes again, it seems the supplier who sourced the used system for me overlooked that it's high pressure. Due to the building being of a small footprint and more importantly, nationally historic, I don't want the headaches of creating a boiler room. Perhaps I'm better off by buying a new system anyway. Again, I appreciate the help!

    Cheers
    High pressure boilers usually have more regulations. Here in TN we would have to have a licensed boiler operator on shift at all times, and he or she would have to check the boilers every 30 minutes and log in. Also, the cost of a boiler installation is usually 1-2 times the actual cost of the boiler. And off the top of my head, I think you would need something in the 10 hp range for a 7 bbl system, if that included a steam heated HLT.
    Linus Hall
    Yazoo Brewing
    Nashville, TN
    [url]www.yazoobrew.com[/url]

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3
    I've been quoting 10bhp so that lines up. As it turns out, here in Ontario, Canada. low pressure systems are unregulated if it's under 15psi. I'm due to meet with a family friend soon who works for the inspection agency. That should make everything clear as mud for me on what I can and can't get away with not just with the boiler but also the 3 phase I need to bring in.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2019
    Location
    Commerce, CA
    Posts
    1

    Jack C

    You need to know if the brew-house is designed for 1 bar (low pressure steam), or more than 1 bar (high pressure steam). Next you will need to know the maximum BTUH that the brew-house requires at one time. 33,475 BTUH = 1 BOILER HORSEPOWER. The boiler should be sized a little larger than the exact requirement. Typically a 10 HORSEPOWER boiler would be a good choice for a 7 bbl system.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    St. John's, Newfoundland, Canada
    Posts
    838
    Take a look at analysis below and assumptions. If your incoming water is significantly colder, your HLT will need much more heat input. I would not do a 7 bbl with less than 10 bHP. Ensure your steam lines are well insulated. YMMV.

    Best of luck,

    Pax.

    Liam

    For a 7 bbl system, with a steam heated HLT and Mash tun,

    7 bbl - Brewhouse HLT Heat Requirements

    Assume: Live steam injection, evap loss 1.5%/hr, boiling loss 5%/hr
    Assume : Sp. heat grains 0.42, Sp. heat water: 1.0, Sp. heat wort: 0.92
    Assume: Single step downward infusion mash, mashing off to 170 F

    Target plato 12.50
    At target plato, lbs extract/bbl 33.94
    Weight of grist - lbs 357.17
    Target volume at strikeout - bbl 7.05
    Volume foundation water - bbl 4.46
    Volume of mash - bbl 5.39

    Water Requirements:

    Sparge volume ratio - bbl/100 lbs material 1.60
    Mash volume ratio - bbl/100 lbs material 1.25
    Incoming water - F (assume cooling recapture) 150.00
    Average temp process water - F 170.00
    Total water requirements - bbl 10.18
    Total water heat requirements - BTU 52728.78

    Mash Lauter Tun Requirements

    bbl equivalents 5.97
    Process time - min 70.00
    Conversion temp - F 150.00
    Mash off temp - F 170.00
    Evap loss - BTU 23711.53
    Raising temp - BTU 30937.22
    Warming equip/radiative loss - % 12.00
    Warming equip/radiative loss - BTU 7452.10
    TOTAL MASH TUN - BTU 62100.85

    Kettle Heat Requirements

    Runoff process time - min 120.00
    Boil time - min 60.00
    Contraction on cooling - 4% - bbl 0.28
    Evap compensation - bbl 0.21
    Boil compensation - bbl 0.35
    Actual vol. sent to kettle - bbl 7.90
    Plato of wort 12.50
    Avg. temp wort and spargings - F 165.00
    Warming wort - BTU 92713.21
    Evap. loss - BTU 59522.18
    Boiling loss - BTU 99203.64
    Warming equip loss - % 2.00
    Radiative loss % 10.00
    TOTAL KETTLE - BTU 285726.18

    TOTAL HEAT PER BREW

    TOTAL WATER - BTU 52728.78
    TOTAL MASH TUN - BTU 62100.85
    TOTAL KETTLE 285726.18
    TOTAL per brew - BTU 400555.82

    Suggest boiler sized at , 0.4 Mbtu output ~12 bHP
    Liam McKenna
    www.yellowbellybrewery.com

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