How to Nitro

[Sopor]

I'm looking at making our first batches of Nitro beers. What do I need to do to a 15BBL Serving tank and the according tap faucet (besides the obvious nitrogen tap) to serve such a beer?

Do I need to carb the beer low (1.2 volumes or so) and then push it with beer gas (CO2/Nitro blend)? Do I need to force Nitrogen or beer gas in my carb stone?

Or is this something that is better handled by serving through kegs?

Thanks for any help! I'm new to brewing on a professional scale

[Jephro]

First off... what is the pressure rating on your serving vessel?

[Sopor]

My serving tanks are rated for 15psi.

[Jephro]

I would plan on doing it in kegs, because you will probably want to use 25-30 PSI to get the Nitrogen in solution. I don't really have any experience doing it that way so hopefully someone else will chime in here with some details.

But yes, you do want a little CO2 (most people seem to say anyway). I just use my 70/30 (70%N / 30%CO2) line to do it from the stone @ 25-30 PSI. You may be able to do it in your BBT, but I'm not going to reccomend it.

- again no experience with this but - From what i have been told to do it in kegs just run like 30PSI Nitrogen down through the spear and let it sit cold with the gas on it for a few days... I assume this is after you have a bit of CO2 in it already.

[CaptainEBC]

I've done this in kegs by pressurizing them to about 30 psi with a 70 /30 ratio of N2 to C02. It works pretty well, but make sure you really tighten the hose clamps. One flew off and I covered my whole garage in Stout.

[lhall]

Carb it normally to about 1.8 vols. Then push it at about 35 psi with a 70 N/ 30 CO2 mix through a stout faucet. Take apart the stout faucet every night and don't let your staff lose the little perforated disk every night either!

[tariq khan]

Nitro

Carb it normally to about 1.8 vols. Then push it at about 35 psi with a 70 N/ 30 CO2 mix through a stout faucet. Take apart the stout faucet every night and don't let your staff lose the little perforated disk every night either!

Linus,

Why do you take apart your stout faucet every night ?
Also do you not get foaming at 1.8 vols ?

T

[TL Services]

1.8vol. CO2 is probably not too bad with a reasonable N2 level, say <20ppm. Going much higher and the keg top-pressure will have to be quite high and lead to possible dispense problems.

You can nitrogenate into your BBT but I'd advise venting the tank as you do so.

Alternative would be to nitrogenate into a main when you're transferring, similar to carbonation.

It all depends on how much N2 you're looking to have in your beer and...as ever...the $$$ to do it

[liammckenna]

Depends on what you're seeking. If you are seeking a saturated (N2) presentation, it is difficult and dangerous to do without the proper equipment and pressure rated vessels. N2 is very stable once it's in solution. Getting it dissolved into solution is the real difficulty.

Our technique:

N2 head pressure in brite. Carb to < 1.5 vol CO2 during filtration. Ensure brite is at 2 bar and max of 33 F.

Set up circulation loop: racking valve-->pump-->valve-->contactor membrane-->bottom center fitting on brite.

Takes about 1 hour per batch. Safe, consistent and repeatable.

Trying to do it at the point of dispense is pretty much a waste of time (ie. merely pushing a low carb beer through a stout faucet with beer gas).

For yourself with 15 psi serving tanks, I would either do it in keg (1.5-1.8 vol, saturated over 2 days with ~30-50psi N@ top pressure) or if you just seek a little N2 for head texture/presentation reasons, try the CO2 stone during transfer technique as mentioned by KWLSD

There are some other very good posts on this elsewhere on this site.

Pax.

Liam

[Sopor]

Thank you all very much for the help! I've got a good idea now of what my options are, and how to proceed!

[Sopor]

A plan

Ok, so here's my current plan. If you guys can just make sure I've got the tecnicals right... then all I should need to do is sell the owner of the pub on my idea

We've been talking for a while about getting an additional serving tank. Currently I've got 7 tanks and 8 taps (doh) so we've been serving from a fermenter to keep the taps full.

If I purchased the tank in this post, which is rated to 45psi... Would I be able to carb to 1.2-1.8 (I'll try low first) and then use the 70/30 blend to push the beer? Would that be enough to get me the full cascading effect and the super smooth body? Or would I still have to force nitrogenate the tank either during transfer or in a stone in the tank?

[Jephro]

If I purchased the tank in this post, which is rated to 45psi... Would I be able to carb to 1.2-1.8 (I'll try low first) and then use the 70/30 blend to push the beer? Would that be enough to get me the full cascading effect and the super smooth body? Or would I still have to force nitrogenate the tank either during transfer or in a stone in the tank?

I transfer into BBT, and just run the 70/30 (N2/CO2) via the stone for 24 hours at 26 PSI. Then pull the 70/30 off the stone and use it to push the beer. Great Nitro presentation, silky smooth Nitro mouthfeel, and its a great beer too. (did a sour mash on my dry irish this year.. YUM)

I bung at the end of fermentation so it has a bit of CO2 in it already, but just running the blend via the stone should do the trick. Works for me every time, sometimes the easy way works best!! Sounds like you have the idea down, so just roll with it and tweak the process to your liking.

[Brancid]

This is a good thread to check out:

http://www.probrewer.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1457

Cellarstream from acbev works well for us. The carb that is left from fermentation (1.2 vols or so) seems to be fine. We keg right from the the uni and let the green box do the rest. We push 40 psi 60/40 blend into the unit and keep the head on the keg at about 15psi of the blend. The unit is a bit pricey, but far cheaper than a new tank...but who doesn't want a new tank...

Here's the web site:

http://www.acbeverage.com/

Charlie is a tough guy to get in touch with, but he will get back to you.

[dmalfara]

We use a Cellarstream for our nitro beers...best decision we've made. We transfer the beer from the unitank to the serving tank and just connect up our beer line to the cellarstream and let it do the rest. The only variable we've found is we have to adjust the pressure on the Cellarstream depending on the residual carbonation level after fermentation. Once that is tweeked we get perfect nitro pours every time. We've had them over 2 years now with zero problems. We clean them during our normal line cleaning program.

[lhall]

Tariq,

We tried "nitrogenating" the beer in the brite tank, but have found pretty repeatable results by carbing to 1.8 vol with just CO2, then pushing the beer with the 70/30 blend. I don't know how much nitrogen is actually in the beer, but it cascades properly and holds a great head.

We take the spout off the faucet and soak it and the disk every night. If you don't, the holes in the disk plug up with dried beer. We don't disassemble the entire faucet, should have been more clear.